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Would you rather a return to the dénouement OR a return of the romantic ending?

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  • MSL49MSL49 Finland
    Posts: 696
    thedove wrote: »
    Nice thoughts. I do think of the two it would be more likely for Bautista to return as he looks very different and could play a totally different character. I rather like when actors return to the fold and really enjoyed some of the returnees from the legacy or EON films.

    Would you rather a return to the dénouement OR a return of the romantic ending?

    These two types of endings are dotted across the series. Both have their place, during the Craig era neither was really evoked which makes me wonder if we might see a return.

    The denouement endings were featured heavily in Hamilton directed films. GF, DAF, LALD and TMWTGG all featured these little endings. Often the baddie or henchman was lurking and would spring a last attack on our man.

    Think Wint and Kidd on the cruise ship, the train fight between Tee Hee and Bond and even Nick Nack attempting revenge on the junk. They left the audience with a bit of action, some humour and became the bow on the movie.

    OR

    The romantic ending. These started to be a staple of the film really in the Dalton and Brosnan era's. Bond and the main girl alone at last and ending the film in a romantic way. Think OP, TLD, LTK, TWINE, and DAD all feature this type of ending. It ends the film with some romance in the air. Good if the relationship between the characters had been a focal point of the movie.

    Which one would you rather see a return to?

    Romantic its part of Bond too.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 16,144
    Romantic, but please no Bond and the "Bond girl are hiding and making out". It's been done to death. Make it closer to the novels, if possible.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    edited October 4 Posts: 3,293
    thedove wrote: »

    Would you rather a return to the dénouement OR a return of the romantic ending?

    The denouement endings were featured heavily in Hamilton directed films. GF, DAF, LALD and TMWTGG all featured these little endings. Often the baddie or henchman was lurking and would spring a last attack on our man.

    I think I would add FRWL to that list with Klebb turning up as the chambermaid in Bond and Tatiana's hotel room. A case could also be made that OHMSS had that sort of ending but with as we all know a tragic ending instead of the standard happy one.
    thedove wrote: »
    The romantic ending. These started to be a staple of the film really in the Dalton and Brosnan era's. Bond and the main girl alone at last and ending the film in a romantic way. Think OP, TLD, LTK, TWINE, and DAD all feature this type of ending. It ends the film with some romance in the air. Good if the relationship between the characters had been a focal point of the movie.

    TLD is my personal favorite of that style of ending.
    thedove wrote: »
    Which one would you rather see a return to?

    Dénouement also known as "sting in the tail" ending. We haven't really had one since Guy Hamilton left the series 51 years ago and we've had plenty of the romantic ones since so I think we're overdue for one.

  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,670
    I want an exhilarating, uplifting, victorious ending with a beautiful woman in Bond’s arms as he gives her a quip and a kiss.
  • TroyTroy
    Posts: 389
    Denouement
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 15,396
    talos7 wrote: »
    I want an exhilarating, uplifting, victorious ending with a beautiful woman in Bond’s arms as he gives her a quip and a kiss.
    This.

    There's no reason we can't be treated to both options - have a henchperson pop up following the main villain's death and threaten the girl which Bond has to save afterwards, i.e. TND.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,284
    Eh, I dunno; both options feel a bit played out to me. The Brosnan films all ended on a romantic clinch and, although I liked the films, I don't remember hugely enjoying the endings, they felt a bit perfunctory and like they were there because they had no better ideas. I think all of the Craig films had better endings to be honest.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,670
    What in cinema hasn’t been “ played out “ ? The key is to find originality for an enduring character/ franchise and what fans of that character/ franchise desire.

    Tom Cruise and company nailed it with Top Gun: Maverick
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,284
    talos7 wrote: »
    What in cinema hasn’t been “ played out “ ? The key is to find originality for an enduring character/ franchise and what fans of that character/ franchise desire.

    Yeah and as I say, the Craig films nailed it for this fan. Who doesn’t love the ending of CR?
  • MSL49MSL49 Finland
    Posts: 696
    talos7 wrote: »
    What in cinema hasn’t been “ played out “ ? The key is to find originality for an enduring character/ franchise and what fans of that character/ franchise desire.

    Tom Cruise and company nailed it with Top Gun: Maverick

    I think big budget really showed in Maverick i saw it in new cinema.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 6,148
    mtm wrote: »
    Eh, I dunno; both options feel a bit played out to me. The Brosnan films all ended on a romantic clinch and, although I liked the films, I don't remember hugely enjoying the endings, they felt a bit perfunctory and like they were there because they had no better ideas. I think all of the Craig films had better endings to be honest.

    I think the Brosnan endings were fairly strong. The only one that stands out to me in a bad way is TND as there was never really any sign of chemistry between Bond and Wai Lin and yet they are clinching on a piece of the ship wreck together.

    I actually liked the ending to GE when the marines pop up around Bond and Natalya. The TWINE ending was a groaner but called back a bit to some of the Moore type endings. The Moneypenny VR scene interrupted the flow of the ending with Bond and Jinx.
  • 007ClassicBondFan007ClassicBondFan
    Posts: 2,687
    Nothing wrong with an ending where Bond gets the girl - in fact after having 4 of the last 5 Bond films ditch that type of ending it’d feel incredibly welcome.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,401
    thedove wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Eh, I dunno; both options feel a bit played out to me. The Brosnan films all ended on a romantic clinch and, although I liked the films, I don't remember hugely enjoying the endings, they felt a bit perfunctory and like they were there because they had no better ideas. I think all of the Craig films had better endings to be honest.

    I think the Brosnan endings were fairly strong. The only one that stands out to me in a bad way is TND as there was never really any sign of chemistry between Bond and Wai Lin and yet they are clinching on a piece of the ship wreck together.

    I actually liked the ending to GE when the marines pop up around Bond and Natalya. The TWINE ending was a groaner but called back a bit to some of the Moore type endings. The Moneypenny VR scene interrupted the flow of the ending with Bond and Jinx.

    Oh, come on! The GE ending is nonsense since there is not a sound to be heard until the marines pop up... in Huey helicopters, which are infamous for making a lot of noise. The TWINE ending was indeed a groaner. And the DAD ending with Bond and Jinx in that temple is just...cringe-inducing. I'd say that the TND ending, no matter how much nonsense happened before it, is the only acceptable one in all of the Brosnan films. Give me any of the "final villain/henchman attacks" of the other films any time.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 6,148
    Interesting how we can view things differently. GE is a popcorn movie, logic is sometimes not strong here. I love the pick up and carry and the giggle from Natalya. It's a cute ending to the film for me. I understand it doesn't make much sense.

  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,284
    thedove wrote: »
    Interesting how we can view things differently. GE is a popcorn movie, logic is sometimes not strong here. I love the pick up and carry and the giggle from Natalya. It's a cute ending to the film for me. I understand it doesn't make much sense.

    My favourite bit about that is that because the helicopters are hovering above the shot until right at the end, James Bond can't hear them :D
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,401
    I'm sure that Q was right about 007 just not paying attention.
  • BT3366BT3366
    Posts: 1,985
    mtm wrote: »
    Eh, I dunno; both options feel a bit played out to me. The Brosnan films all ended on a romantic clinch and, although I liked the films, I don't remember hugely enjoying the endings, they felt a bit perfunctory and like they were there because they had no better ideas. I think all of the Craig films had better endings to be honest.

    This. At least the Craig endings felt more like out of the Fleming novels where Bond wasn't always in the best position and sometimes worn down by what he's experienced. The LTK and the latter two Brosnan endings felt forced complete with the bad dad jokes.
  • Reflsin2bourbonsReflsin2bourbons
    edited October 5 Posts: 532
    mtm wrote: »
    thedove wrote: »
    Interesting how we can view things differently. GE is a popcorn movie, logic is sometimes not strong here. I love the pick up and carry and the giggle from Natalya. It's a cute ending to the film for me. I understand it doesn't make much sense.

    My favourite bit about that is that because the helicopters are hovering above the shot until right at the end, James Bond can't hear them :D

    Perhaps we were too harsh on Stacey?

    While the original "denouement" in Bond (Wint and Kidd vs Bond on the Queen Elizabeth in Fleming's DAF) is one of my favourite passages, it perhaps only works for me because it isn't exactly true to the trope! Since one of the Spangs is alive it makes sense for a henchman to chase after in revenge, whereas in many films it never exactly made sense what they had to gain for going after Bond at their own expense.

    The romantic endings, while perhaps more cliche, fit better for me.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    edited October 6 Posts: 6,148
    To me the DAF, LALD and TMWTGG endings were a personal nature. Tee Hee was now part of a destroyed network and had no leader so he's going for revenge. Nic Nack has just watched his inheritance go up in flames. I do think Wint and Kidd make the least sense from a film perspective.

    GF and FRWL both have the big bad coming back to tangle one last time. Klebb in desperation to gain the Lektor and Goldfinger to tidy up a loose end and gain revenge on Bond.

    QOS has this type of ending now that I am thinking more about it. The Guy Haines ending would have even had more of this type of ending.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,941
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    I'm sure that Q was right about 007 just not paying attention.

    Would you? if you had Isabell- eh, Natalya in your arms?

    I don't really care for the ending as long as it fits the story and isn't an afterthought. I thought TMWTGG was quite nasty, and, as was stated above, TND is the best for Brozzers' Bond. It makes sense and fits the story.

    It all depends on the style they're going for, and as of now, I haven't got a clue where they're going to take him.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,992
    Although somewhat repetitive/mirroring (CR/QoS and SF/SP), the Craig endings are interesting because they all differ from the tropes in some way.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited 11:17am Posts: 19,284
    I guess Spectre is as close as they got to the trad romantic/happy ending, and to be honest I kind of preferred it to most of those.

    What are folks favourite/least favourite endings i.e. final scenes?
    I'd probably go for CR as my favourite as it just leaves you feeling so pumped, although I really like FRWL (even though it doesn't really make sense!); and I'd put MR up there for being just so wonderfully outrageous.
    Least favourite probably TND, because it's like they felt like it had to end on that note even though it didn't ring true to the relationship between the characters at all and just falls a bit flat. The Maxwell gag is good though.

    The TB one is weird: it has that amazing stunt (it's hard to believe that thing is real, they take off at such a speed you'd think their necks would break. Tom Cruise really needs to do that one!) and yet it kind of has no impact and nothing really goes on with the characters, and then the film just suddenly stops. An odd one- sort of both good and bad.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,992
    I think the ending of TLD is kind of perfect.

    TWINE is my least favorite, so crude. And DAD repeats the offense. At least MR adds some panache to its innuendo.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,941
    For me both CR and QoS are very memorable and are perfect endings to the story. I love TB as well, as @mtm said, the stund was epic and it does make some sense. Allthough, obviously, sending a helicopter would've been a lot easier (and safer).
    Come to think of it, though I don't like the movie much, Spectre does have a fitting end. It's just the getting there that I really don't like. Oh, and Dr. No, is nice as well.

    My least favorite is TMWTGG. That one is just evil. Other than that, I think most are ok.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 6,148
    I find the TND and FYEO rather weird in that both have Bond and the female lead together and doing romantic things when there really hasn't been much of time or care paid to the romance aspect of their relations.

    When you think of Carole's age and her shedding of the bathrobe to a man almost old enough to be her father...cringe.

    Best endings? I will always love the OHMSS and I don't mind the Bond theme swelling after. I actually quite enjoy the DAF ending and it's cute teasing of Case proposing to Bond at the end. The TLD is well done, though not a fan of the comedy "We got held up at the airport".
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited 7:58pm Posts: 19,284
    CommanderRoss wrote: »
    My least favorite is TMWTGG. That one is just evil. Other than that, I think most are ok.

    Yeah, it's got a decent quality filthy gag, but there's something about Bond going to that island to kill Scaramanga and steal his solex gadget, and then ending up nicking his yacht and shagging the girl in Scaramanga's actual bed that all seems a bit lower and grubbier than Bond's usual style. Plus torturing Nick Nack as I think you allude to: it really is the film where James Bond is a proper bastard.
    But then Lulu sings his name and it does make it a bit better.
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