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I mean, even DAD has a sense of 'it's nowhere near as bad as I thought' so that should say something about the longevity of official Bond films.
And NSNA was liked at the time but now It has a lot of enemies: TB fans, Roger Moore fans and EON.
That seems to be more of a nostalgic factor than the films actually holding up. Like millennials fondly looking back at that first TRANSFORMERS film.
TB's plot is ridiculous. SPECTRE always seemed to go out of its way to make things 1000x more complicated than necessary and this is especially so with TB. There was no reason to hire Angelo to go through with all of that. Thomas Harris came up with a better, more reasonable plan of similar purpose in Black Sunday. Just find someone's who's bent.
Plus, it's quite the coincidence that Bond is at Shrublands when Lippe is there.
Nevertheless...
I love it.
Objectively, it's one of the most boring Bond films ever made. Not a lot happens until the final act. It's basically Bond sleuthing around the Bahamas. But that is what I like most about it. The film has to rely on character, and it does: the script is witty and the film includes four classic/great Bond girls. The post-sex scene between Bond and Volpe is one of my faves in the entire series. We sense there was attraction and sexual chemistry between the two and had circumstances been different, who knows how they'd have ended up. Volpe is visibly shaken by Bond saying "You don't think it gave me any pleasure, do you?" Damn.
The film hits me every time.
PS: But this thread should be about SF, not TB and NSNA.
I totally see why it's right up there for a lot of fans: Sean is terrific in it- he's a walking sex bomb, the locations are gorgeous, it's 60s cool at its height on the surface, the score is wonderful, the jokes are good... it's just got a great texture and it feels like a million dollars on screen.
I love all that of that stuff too- there's no Bond film I dislike. But it does have problems for me: as you say the pacing is very slack, Largo is a bit of a characterless villain- overall it lacks that craziness and wit that Goldfinger heralded: there's no laser beam or Oddjob or ingenious nuclear plan and even Bond's gadgets are a bit dull, it's all a bit less inventive and feels more 50s than 60s in its thinking. They (slowly) steal a bomb and then ransom it, that's it. There's loads of good stuff in it, but it feels more of a missed opportunity for me than a solid win.
Because he's played by Lee. Silva is also highly rated because of who plays him.
Probably not even top ten for me.
I'd be careful with preference revealers:
https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/crosstabs_James_Bond.pdf
Millennials claim DAD is the best...
Is it that you think the survey you linked to says that or are those unrelated statements? Because it doesn't.
Now though, over a decade and many rewatches later when it’s just another Bond film to me instead of THE Bond film everyone’s talking about? My criticisms still remain but they’ve settled into quibbles among the comforting glow of a very fun — despite the bleakness — Bond adventure. Even the best Bond films have plenty of nits one could pick, but I find they often stand by their strongest elements rather than their weakest and Skyfall has a lot of strengths to boast of. One of my favorite pre-title sequences, a great villain, beautiful cinematography, some solid setpieces (played in minor key compared to the more bombastic stuff we tend to get), and a narrative that I think nicely crests the “personal deep dive into Bond’s psyche” without overplaying its hand and forgetting to be a Bond film.
Is it the best Bond film? Not for me. A solid placer in my top 10 though, and I find it very rewatchable and a very good example of blockbuster filmmaking when such examples are getting harder and harder to come by.
It's awful, isn't it? Hayden Whatsisface getting critically reassessed. It may not be long until paid media sources get whip of the wind and start tailoring to suit.
Seen TWINE getting reassessed positively, too. I listen to the arguments but none of them are compelling. Same with SF's critical mass: none of its myriad criticism are answered by the film itself.
Seeing DAD get a thumbs up really isn't surprising. SF truly is its spiritual successor.
Genuinely though, where are you seeing DAD getting this thumbs up? That poll you posted doesn’t show that.
When Amazon announces the Jinx spin-off, you'll see how many fans of the movie show up.
;)
That's a good point.
I find it interesting to watch Calvin Dyson sometimes as his first cinema Bond film was DAD so that's the one he feels nostalgic for (although I think objectively he's aware of its shortcomings), and I get the sense that Brosnan has a bit of a place in his heart. He's also very much all about the video games which came out around turn of the century.
I have, chief. I remember having rows with my brethren about it when it came out. It got good reviews with special mention for its anniversary feel (chimed with the not-yet outdated reference culture of the 90s).
Retrospective reviews focus on the inanities (invisible car, terrible cgi) but for its time, it was given the green light. Now, it's been resuscitated by the 'so bad it's good' crowd.
I swear the producers had video games in mind for TWINE. There are some godawful action sequences, mostly unnecessary in it, leading into DAD's cgi disasterclass.
Christ, GoldenEye was an awesome video game and a triumphant film, too. It didn't deserve the sneering contempt Skyfall threw it, especially considering its own largesse of incoherence (Though it's champions will probably suggest, it was 'tongue in cheek').
Not in that YouGov survey it hasn't.
Is this just about the exploding pen line? Goodness me.
If I’m nostalgic for anything, maybe it’s more of that time in 2002 when Bond was truly omnipresent. Between the release of a new Bond film in cinemas, watching cable playing Bond marathons on both Thanksgiving and Christmas weeks, and the release of Nightfire. I definitely miss the franchise being so active in the 2000s.
I've never been a big fan of Brosnan's Bond, but even I'm nostalgic for that era. At least they were releasing Bond movies!
Me neither. It's a Bond I purposefully avoid.
However, I think also the continued opprobrium given to DAD becomes so excessive, it can lead into newer, younger eyes wondering what all the fuss is. Fresh from watching and being instructed by the likes of NTTD or Skyfall, they'd watch DAD and see a plausible, rudimentary action film with, okay, terrible cgi, but afatk, okay for its time (like us watching older Dr Who etc).
That's true. DAD suggests they probably shouldn't have! But yes, it was good to have the excitement of a new movie, even if it wasn't the best.
I thought QOS being two years after CR would herald a similar production line, just not to be.
I can imagine amazon will, though.
Possibly. To be fair it’s not a film I have nostalgia for, and on rewatches even I don’t think it’s as bad as some claim. Not to say it’s a great Bond film, and I haven’t seen anyone claim it’s perfect. But I don’t think it’s a ‘so bad it’s good’ film either.
There’s definitely stuff to enjoy about TB, but for me it sits quite low. I think sometimes there’s this idea that the first four Bond films were perfect and can’t be surpassed. It depends on one’s opinion but it’s not something I’ve ever felt to be true, as great as those films are.
TB is one I previously didn't enjoy, but a discussion on this forum gave me food for thought.
Looking forward to checking it out again.
Yeah, I don't think Dr No is all that great especially, I certainly very rarely watch it. I respect it as a classic and it's an important starting point and it is a very decent film, but the films got better and more enjoyable from that point for me.
Yes, I think DN is a film which shows how far the series has come! I enjoy it a lot whenever I get the chance to rewatch it, but personally it sits just outside my personal top ten Bond films. For me, FRWL and GF are the films that refined the franchise and are what I’d consider to be great Bond movies, as well as great movies in general. TB and YOLT aren’t favourites of mine, are and probably two of my least revisited, but they certainly have their highs.
Dr No is quite underrated IMO and the film proves something: The fun isn't in the action, but in seeing Bond being cool.