Thunderball vs. You Only Live Twice- which do you prefer?

24

Comments

  • Junglist_1985Junglist_1985 Los Angeles
    Posts: 599
    slide_99 wrote: »
    YOLT. I like TB but the first act is a mess. Just start the movie with the jets being hijacked and get rid of all the stuff at Shrublands and you knock off 20 minutes of runtime.

    I really agree with that sentiment… the first 45 mins of TB are quite bland. The movie really kicks into gear once they are in the Bahamas. I often say that the “middle hour” of TB is one of the best Bond films in the series, but regrettably the first 45 mins and last 15-20 really drag.

    Point to TB, but barely.
  • Posts: 550
    slide_99 wrote: »
    YOLT. I like TB but the first act is a mess. Just start the movie with the jets being hijacked and get rid of all the stuff at Shrublands and you knock off 20 minutes of runtime.

    I really agree with that sentiment… the first 45 mins of TB are quite bland. The movie really kicks into gear once they are in the Bahamas. I often say that the “middle hour” of TB is one of the best Bond films in the series, but regrettably the first 45 mins and last 15-20 really drag.

    Point to TB, but barely.
    For me it’s the opposite. I love the Spectre boardroom (best scene in the film) and the stuff at Shrublands has great atmosphere and mystery. Once we get to the Bahamas it begins to drag. The cinematography and location is beautiful and I love the Bahamas flavor and Barry’s score is sublime, but unfortunately the film gets very leisurely at that point.

    YOLT is probably my favorite Bond film of the 60s. Along with GF.
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    edited January 5 Posts: 1,193
    As a lad, I saw these two as a double-feature at the drive-in circa 1967. I thought YOLT (being new, the first feature) was stupendous, I loved it. I found TB to be boring and confusing by comparison (I was five).

    Now, I prefer TB by a decent clip, it contains the best dialogue in the series. I still think YOLT is a blast, though. I love them both.
  • Posts: 11,084
    Birdleson wrote: »
    As a lad, I saw these two as a double-feature at the drive-in circa 1967. I thought YOLT (being new, the first feature) was stupendous, I loved it. I found TB to be boring and confusing by comparison (I was five).

    Now, I prefer TB by a decent clip, it contains the best dialogue in the series. I still think YOLT is a blast, though. I love them both.

    I think it’s worth noting how Bond tastes can change with age. As a young one, I’d have said YOLT and DAF were two of my favorite Connery films (with GF and DN also liked a lot, particularly the former). Found myself also bored through several points of TB and FRWL, which are now my favorite Connery films as an adult. Another film I loved as a kid I don’t so much anymore is TWINE…
  • YOLT was far and away my favorite Bond film as a kid. Ninja armies? Hollowed out volcano lairs? Say no more. It’s so larger than life it immediately appeals to the childlike imagination.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 7,216
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    I'd also side with YOLT, no matter how silly it is at times. But my TB appreciation truly suffers from myself having watched NSNA several times before ever seeing TB for the first time, and sort of being trained to like it or at least be accustomed to it. I still think that TB is more boring and less entertaining than NSNA (whatever the merits on cinematography and whatever stuff in comparison), but this definitely shaped my view of TB. Therefore, YOLT takes the cake here.

    Is it because you're German that you prefer leather-clad Fatima over Fiona? Or is that too much of a stereotype... ;-)

    For me TB takes the cake. I find the women superior (Fiona AND Domino), the story more compelling and the villain far better. Now I know people think Adolfo's Largo to be 'boring' but I like my villains brooding and silently dangerous, and the way he plays it really works for me. I also like the fact that he's not the top boss.

    YOLT has a fantastic soundtrack, but the story hardly holds together and even though it certainly has one of the best Bond allies, it just doesn't work that well. Ninja armies don't really interest me that much.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,245
    Karin Dor is the hottest female ever in a Bond movie* (and yes I know that's quite a statement in the face of women like Jane Seymour, Claudine Auger, Akiko Wakabayshi, & Monica Bellucci).


    *The opinion of Chrisisall does not necessarily reflect the beliefs of his parent company ShowChrisTheDor, nor any of its subsidiaries.



  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 1,519
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Karin Dor is the hottest female ever in a Bond movie* (and yes I know that's quite a statement in the face of women like Jane Seymour, Claudine Auger, Akiko Wakabayshi, & Monica Bellucci).


    *The opinion of Chrisisall does not necessarily reflect the beliefs of his parent company ShowChrisTheDor, nor any of its subsidiaries.



    :)) =))

    **As a member of the DianaRiggWorshipers cult, I can't forgive your lapse in judgement!!!
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,245
    Dwayne wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Karin Dor is the hottest female ever in a Bond movie* (and yes I know that's quite a statement in the face of women like Jane Seymour, Claudine Auger, Akiko Wakabayshi, & Monica Bellucci).


    *The opinion of Chrisisall does not necessarily reflect the beliefs of his parent company ShowChrisTheDor, nor any of its subsidiaries.



    :)) =))

    **As a member of the DianaRiggWorshipers cult, I can't forgive your lapse in judgement!!!
    She was appeeling, but hot is a bad girl thing in Bond movies! ;)
  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 1,519
    Well played @chrisisall. Well played.

    One of the weaknesses of TB is that Fiona Volpe (Luciana Paluzzi) is – IMO – a much more interesting character than her boss - Emilio Largo. When she takes the bullet, not only does she die, but the air seems to come out of the film. Up until then TB is a top ten Bond film for me, after that, it sags.

    The suspense of YOLT, on the other hand, only seems to build.

    Old joke: TB goes underwater when the film goes underwater.
  • marcmarc Universal Exports
    Posts: 1,985
    I much prefer YOLT. The difference in quality between the finales alone is enormous.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,245
    marc wrote: »
    I much prefer YOLT. The difference in quality between the finales alone is enormous.

    THANK YOU!
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    edited January 7 Posts: 7,216
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Karin Dor is the hottest female ever in a Bond movie* (and yes I know that's quite a statement in the face of women like Jane Seymour, Claudine Auger, Akiko Wakabayshi, & Monica Bellucci).


    *The opinion of Chrisisall does not necessarily reflect the beliefs of his parent company ShowChrisTheDor, nor any of its subsidiaries.



    E3gmVjWWUAAD_Ao?format=jpg&name=900x900
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    edited February 26 Posts: 2,520
    YOLT for Blofeld, more fun and enjoyable cast and main setting. It also proves that straying from the original source material and book and not using Richard Maibaum for writing, that Bond could truly live more than twice! Not to mention, YOLT has more unique opinions and reactions from critics, the general audience and most of all, the fans. There have been more fun reference books with fan’s thoughts written about YOLT than TB, which always seems to be about the legal battles and it’s slow pace.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,245
    Throwing a ton of cash at a Bond movie is IMHO generally a bad idea. But with YOLT it worked. It worked again for TSWLM, but not so much for MR (though box office would say differently).
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited February 26 Posts: 17,245
    .
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited February 26 Posts: 17,245
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Karin Dor is the hottest female ever in a Bond movie* (and yes I know that's quite a statement in the face of women like Jane Seymour, Claudine Auger, Akiko Wakabayshi, & Monica Bellucci).


    *The opinion of Chrisisall does not necessarily reflect the beliefs of his parent company ShowChrisTheDor, nor any of its subsidiaries.



    E3gmVjWWUAAD_Ao?format=jpg&name=900x900
    OKzRenG0MDFrvPDIQwzDFTATrx.jpg
  • Whirlybird_FanWhirlybird_Fan Sydney, Australia
    Posts: 39
    TB, no doubt about it.
  • Thunderball for sure. It's messily edited and is basically a suspense-free cakewalk for James Bond, but its sunny setting and leisurely pace makes for a relaxing watch.

    There are things I like in YOLT, but something very stupid happens every couple of minutes, and it kills the fun for me. A few:

    -Bond's fake death makes no sense, as has been widely discussed
    -We twice see screens displaying footage that cannot possibly be filmed
    -Osato's idea to publicly murder Bond with his uniformed guards instead of killing him in his building makes no sense
    -Aki driving up randomly to save Bond in front of Osato's HQ actually happens TWICE(!)
    -Helga's method of killing Bond is the dumbest thing imaginable and looks awful
    -Blofeld should obviously steal capsules from one side only

    etc, etc

    And this isn't a failure to suspend disbelief or anything: I love fantastic Bond. These are just dumb things that could have been done in a way that's not dumb.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 4,826
    Thunderball for sure. It's messily edited and is basically a suspense-free cakewalk for James Bond, but its sunny setting and leisurely pace makes for a relaxing watch.

    There are things I like in YOLT, but something very stupid happens every couple of minutes, and it kills the fun for me. A few:

    -Bond's fake death makes no sense, as has been widely discussed
    -We twice see screens displaying footage that cannot possibly be filmed
    -Osato's idea to publicly murder Bond with his uniformed guards instead of killing him in his building makes no sense
    -Aki driving up randomly to save Bond in front of Osato's HQ actually happens TWICE(!)
    -Helga's method of killing Bond is the dumbest thing imaginable and looks awful
    -Blofeld should obviously steal capsules from one side only

    etc, etc

    And this isn't a failure to suspend disbelief or anything: I love fantastic Bond. These are just dumb things that could have been done in a way that's not dumb.

    But I love all those things.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 6,999
    I'm always absorbed by Thunderball's visuals and atmosphere.
  • SeanCraigSeanCraig Germany
    Posts: 725
    I don't even need a second to answer this question: Thunderball. By far superior in mostly all aspects ... Connery himself, Plot ... the only things superb (imho) about YOLT is the title song and the volcano lair set.
  • Bentley007Bentley007 Manitoba, Canada
    Posts: 528
    I think it depends on if your preference is a good Bond film vs a good Bond in a film. Connery in Thunderball is incredible but the movie lets me down. Whereas Connery in You Only Live Twice is lackluster but the film is a huge spectacle. I really like You Only Live Twice. The score is my favourite, its mainly a one location film, also my favourite and its plot has just the right amount of real life stakes vs fantasy. This is all wothout mentioning the sets of YOLT, which are iconic. How this film didnt win for Production Design at the Oscars bafffles me.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,245
    Bentley007 wrote: »
    I think it depends on if your preference is a good Bond film vs a good Bond in a film. Connery in Thunderball is incredible but the movie lets me down. Whereas Connery in You Only Live Twice is lackluster but the film is a huge spectacle. I really like You Only Live Twice. The score is my favourite, its mainly a one location film, also my favourite and its plot has just the right amount of real life stakes vs fantasy. This is all wothout mentioning the sets of YOLT, which are iconic. How this film didnt win for Production Design at the Oscars bafffles me.

    Nicely put!
  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 1,519
    Bentley007 wrote: »
    I think it depends on if your preference is a good Bond film vs a good Bond in a film. Connery in Thunderball is incredible but the movie lets me down. Whereas Connery in You Only Live Twice is lackluster but the film is a huge spectacle. I really like You Only Live Twice. The score is my favourite, its mainly a one location film, also my favourite and its plot has just the right amount of real life stakes vs fantasy. This is all wothout mentioning the sets of YOLT, which are iconic. How this film didnt win for Production Design at the Oscars bafffles me.

    Was "Production Design" even a category back then? Maybe the "Art Direction" was the closest.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40th_Academy_Awards
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 28 Posts: 10,451
    Thunderball is slicker and has Connery at his peak, but YOLT is the winner for me because it’s zippy and exciting and fun and crazy.

    YOLT is the one which is the sequel to Goldfinger: it understands what that film got right and what excited audiences about cinematic Bond. Crazy gadgets, fantastic villains and their lairs, preposterous situations etc. TB ignores all this and goes for an actually really quite pedestrian plot and sticks to the book too closely: there’s nothing in the vein of Oddjob or laser beams or cars with ejector seats. This time his car shoots water, his camera takes photos underwater… yawn. Even Bond’s jet pack is slightly boringly real and he does nothing interesting with it. The most useful gadget he has (genuinely!) is a bucket with a glass bottom. The boat that splits in two is pretty good though.
    YOLT is scrappier, but it’s the one which looks at Goldfinger and understands why that hit a nerve with the public.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 28 Posts: 10,451
    Dwayne wrote: »

    One of the weaknesses of TB is that Fiona Volpe (Luciana Paluzzi) is – IMO – a much more interesting character than her boss - Emilio Largo. When she takes the bullet, not only does she die, but the air seems to come out of the film. Up until then TB is a top ten Bond film for me, after that, it sags.

    Yeah, I guess they couldn’t have known when writing it as it’s pretty much all in the performance, but it always seems to me that the film would be a lot stronger if Volpe had been the main villain instead of Largo: she’s so much better. She should be Number 2.
    She wasn’t even dubbed by Nikki Van Der Zyl!
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,642
    Definitely Thunderball. Yes, it drags in places but it doesn't sacrifice the character for spectacle. And Connery was at the top of his game in it.

    The only time I stick on YOLT is for completion of a Bondathon. I'm more likely to play the soundtrack, which is rather excellent and features my favourite Bond song.
  • Posts: 1,070
    They both display a trend which stayed very strong for numerous Bond films, which is this: At the end, Bond "calls in the cavalry" CR on TV ? Nope. DN ? Nope. Just Bond. FRWL: Help, but not a swarm of warriors to finish off the bad guys. GF ? Yup. [And TB. CR '67 ?] Oh yup. YOLT. And OHMSS. And DAF. LALD ? Nope. TMWTGG ? Nope. TSWLM ? Yup, though Bond did rescue them. (He rescued astronauts in YOLT but they did not comprise the Ninja forces). MR ? Yup. FYEO ? Nope. NSNA ? Yup, as in TB, the source. OP ? Yup. AVTAK ? Nope. TLD ? Yup but nope. The Mujahadin helped but the there were multiple endings in effect here. Was Whitaker supposed to be the last-threat from henchmen, as in DAF ? Whatever...LTK ? Nope, but watering down the destruction of the lair with "comic relief" from the televangelist does not help create an impression of danger, GE ? Nope. TND ? From a distance, yes. But right at the location and right with the henchman and villain - Bond and his partner, but not a large force fighting there with him. TWINE ? Nope. DAD ? Bond and partner, again, and not a large force fighting there with him. CR ? Nope. QOS ? Nope. SF ? Nope. SP ? Nope. NTTD ? Help from the distance at the end, as in TND, and assisted by a partner, but, at the end, nope. Apologies for not knowing about the radio plays.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 28 Posts: 10,451
    I've never been much of a fan of the cavalry endings, watching lots of stuntmen do flips as 'grenades' explode nearly but not entirely nowhere near them just leaves me a bit cold really.
Sign In or Register to comment.