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WITH A MIND TO KILL by Anthony Horowitz (May 2022)

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  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,935
  • KronsteenKronsteen Stockholm
    edited December 2021 Posts: 783
    Let the sport commence!



  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,935
    Sounds impossible to guess, but I like the more wordy titles. Nice to know there's a Bond title we don't know yet.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    edited December 2021 Posts: 12,996
    It's the beginning
    --If five 1-syllable words--
    Of a haiku, y'all.

    russell_frog.jpg?w=144

  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    The Colonel Who Brainwashed Me
  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,767
    ImpertinentGoon wrote: »
    The Colonel Who Brainwashed Me

    your probably right

    From Russia I was Brainwashed...
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    Dude, where's my atomic bomb?

    Wait, that's not Fleming.

    Diamonds are always getting smuggled?
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited December 2021 Posts: 14,935


  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    edited December 2021 Posts: 17,787
    That's great news that they're following the theme as before with Horowitz of including Fleming material in the new Bond novel. We hadn't heard anything about that until now so its good to get confirmation. The fact that there's a Fleming reference in the title sounds intriguing too.
  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,767
    ok so thurday I can wait
  • TheQueensPeaceTheQueensPeace That's Classified
    Posts: 74
    horowitz is a nice guy and very distinguished tv writer. But this is fan fic. he has a trilogy and adds little to anything imho. Fleming would be laughing. The books can and should be radical in a manner the movies imho cannot /should not. it's all upside down and back to front. Bring back deaver or bring on will self / martin amis/tom cain et al.
    still, anything is better than the nonsense spin off with the absent bond
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    Posts: 2,161
    TheQueensPeace wrote: »
    horowitz is a nice guy and very distinguished tv writer. But this is fan fic. he has a trilogy and adds little to anything imho. Fleming would be laughing.

    That’s about exactly what I was saying on here for a couple of years, in fact that’s exactly what I was saying, but we do get the unreleased Fleming and most people on here really enjoy these new books. If you can take his works as Bond adventures and don’t even try to conflate it with literary Fleming, they’re okay.
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    edited December 2021 Posts: 2,161
    Dragonpol wrote: »
    That's great news that they're following the theme as before with Horowitz of including Fleming material in the new Bond novel. We hadn't heard anything about that until now so its good to get confirmation. The fact that there's a Fleming reference in the title sounds intriguing too.

    Fleming reference in the title. The obvious, SPECTRE, LICENCE TO KILL, THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH, GOLDENEYE, have all been used. Something naval?
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    "The Great Russian Honeypot" ;)
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,935
    Birdleson wrote: »
    Dragonpol wrote: »
    That's great news that they're following the theme as before with Horowitz of including Fleming material in the new Bond novel. We hadn't heard anything about that until now so its good to get confirmation. The fact that there's a Fleming reference in the title sounds intriguing too.

    Fleming reference in the title. The obvious, SPECTRE, LICENCE TO KILL, THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH, GOLDENEYE, have all been used. Something naval?

    Didn't he say it was a spin on a previous title? My guess is Risico007 might have been onto something with a FRWL spin.
  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,767
    TheQueensPeace wrote: »
    horowitz is a nice guy and very distinguished tv writer. But this is fan fic. he has a trilogy and adds little to anything imho. Fleming would be laughing. The books can and should be radical in a manner the movies imho cannot /should not. it's all upside down and back to front. Bring back deaver or bring on will self / martin amis/tom cain et al.
    still, anything is better than the nonsense spin off with the absent bond

    Holy cow I thought I was the only one...


    I mean I will still read it because I like being apart of the conversation..

    heck I likely will read the 00 books because maybe IFP will take a hint and give us modern bond novels again.
  • zebrafishzebrafish <°)))< in Octopussy's garden in the shade
    Posts: 4,312
    TheQueensPeace wrote: »
    horowitz is a nice guy and very distinguished tv writer. But this is fan fic. he has a trilogy and adds little to anything imho. Fleming would be laughing. The books can and should be radical in a manner the movies imho cannot /should not. it's all upside down and back to front. Bring back deaver or bring on will self / martin amis/tom cain et al.
    still, anything is better than the nonsense spin off with the absent bond

    I am surprised about the support this opinion gets, because I got the impression that most here were rather happy with the style of the Horowitz books. I find them quite clever and very well written in a style approximating and respecting Fleming.
    Like the films, the novels continue, and for the time being Horowitz has been the most successful in recent years, hence he has been asked to pen a novel for the third time. Faulkes, Deaver and Boyd all had their problems and have had their go at the material.
    Maybe it would make more sense to argue what people expect from the next author and who would fit that shoe?
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    zebrafish wrote: »
    TheQueensPeace wrote: »
    horowitz is a nice guy and very distinguished tv writer. But this is fan fic. he has a trilogy and adds little to anything imho. Fleming would be laughing. The books can and should be radical in a manner the movies imho cannot /should not. it's all upside down and back to front. Bring back deaver or bring on will self / martin amis/tom cain et al.
    still, anything is better than the nonsense spin off with the absent bond

    I am surprised about the support this opinion gets, because I got the impression that most here were rather happy with the style of the Horowitz books. I find them quite clever and very well written in a style approximating and respecting Fleming.
    Like the films, the novels continue, and for the time being Horowitz has been the most successful in recent years, hence he has been asked to pen a novel for the third time. Faulkes, Deaver and Boyd all had their problems and have had their go at the material.
    Maybe it would make more sense to argue what people expect from the next author and who would fit that shoe?

    Count me in as a fan of Horowitz.
  • ColonelAdamskiColonelAdamski UK
    Posts: 1,001
    I'm very much looking forward to the next Horowitz Bond, (especially after my disappointment with the last movie). I think of them as well written Fleming tributes, and rate them higher than most of the continuation authors.
    One thing Horowitz has going for him is placing them in Fleming's world. So if you read a lot of Fleming, you're not put off your stride by Bond surfing the internet (Benson) or whatever.
    I sometimes wonder how we'd find a new Fleming novel now, if was presented to us under a pseudonym and we didn't know it was Fleming. I imagine a lot of us would pick it apart a lot more critically simply because 'it's not Fleming'.
    What I mean is, when we read Fleming now, we are mindful of the fact these are considered modern classics written by 'the master'. But when we read a continuation author, I sometimes think we sit there with our subconscious arms folded - thinking 'all right then, let's see what you've come up with this time'.
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    edited December 2021 Posts: 2,161
    Horowitz isn't that good a writer, simple as that (though he is a master when his work is placed next to that of Benson). It has zero to do with plot/story, it is his prose that come across as amateur. Just pick a random page and it is apparent. It's nothing to be argued (at least I wouldn't know how), one either comes away with that feeling/opinion or not. But he does give a certain corner of fandom what they want: thrilling Bond adventures set in Fleming continuity with a more cinematic bent.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    I suppose his books aren't extremely memorable (not as much as Fleming of course), but I'm still happy to have them / excited to get them. They're certainly better than what we're getting from Dynamite. I think Trigger Mortis is probably my preferred Horowitz, over FAAD, but again I'm very happy to have both and I enjoyed them
    I'm with you @Birdleson, I couldn't argue the finer points of what makes a good writer versus a bad one, it's just a feeling. And I'm excited for his third novel.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,935
    NickTwentyTwo wrote: »
    zebrafish wrote: »
    TheQueensPeace wrote: »
    horowitz is a nice guy and very distinguished tv writer. But this is fan fic. he has a trilogy and adds little to anything imho. Fleming would be laughing. The books can and should be radical in a manner the movies imho cannot /should not. it's all upside down and back to front. Bring back deaver or bring on will self / martin amis/tom cain et al.
    still, anything is better than the nonsense spin off with the absent bond

    I am surprised about the support this opinion gets, because I got the impression that most here were rather happy with the style of the Horowitz books. I find them quite clever and very well written in a style approximating and respecting Fleming.
    Like the films, the novels continue, and for the time being Horowitz has been the most successful in recent years, hence he has been asked to pen a novel for the third time. Faulkes, Deaver and Boyd all had their problems and have had their go at the material.
    Maybe it would make more sense to argue what people expect from the next author and who would fit that shoe?

    Count me in as a fan of Horowitz.

    Yeah they're very entertaining and professionally-written books. For a bit of Bond fun they're much better than most of the continuation novels: the Benson ones are the ones I'd call fanfiction because they're so poorly-written. Anyone expecting a Bond novel to ever be of the quality of Fleming again has their hopes way too high: he was one of the the best thriller writers ever. Just enjoy them for what they are.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,104
    I think James Bond continuation authors are cursed by us. We grade them too hard. We should be grateful that they are still being made. No one can ever copy Ian Fleming, but maybe that’s a good thing. We have to accept that. Other than Faulks, the average author is more of a breath of fresh air than hearing Purvis and Wade keep coming back for more family drama soap operas.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 12,996
    ColonelAdamski wrote: »
    I sometimes wonder how we'd find a new Fleming novel now, if was presented to us under a pseudonym and we didn't know it was Fleming. I imagine a lot of us would pick it apart a lot more critically simply because 'it's not Fleming'.

    Heck yeah, @ColonelAdamski, you can see folks are predisposed to that.

    New films, too.

  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    edited December 2021 Posts: 2,161
    I’m always hesitant to proscribe reasons for other peoples likes, dislikes or opinions, even if it seems so on the service, because where do you go from there. You’re basically telling the person “You don’t really believe what you say you believe, you’re stuck in a mindset”. To which they say “no I’m not”, which always sounds lame. It has a tendency to lead to undercut legitimate criticisms.

    There are several continuation authors who I’ve applauded, but certainly none of them are Fleming. He’s one of my favorite authors for a reason. His style is unique and stimulating. I consider Fleming, Graham and le Carre to be the three master espionage writers of the 20th Century, and it’s hard, nigh impossible, to break into that Trinity. Not only was each a wonderful writer, dexterous with English language, but each also worked in military intelligence either during World War II or immediately after. And each told there stories in completely different ways: different styles, fashions, and approach (Fleming pulp, le Carre real world, Graham irony). Love all three.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    I should check out some Graham. Can you make a recommendation for a first?
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    Posts: 2,161
    THE THIRD MAN or OUR MAN IN HAVANA would do it!.
  • DoctorNoDoctorNo USA-Maryland
    Posts: 754
    I think Horowitz' prose are his strong feature... and much better than most if not all continuation writers... his stories and plots are okay, his characters his weakest point, not in description but in conceptualization... you likely need 3 writers to equal Fleming and a 4th to add the undefinable magic...

    But unless Horowitz' third work is fantastic, I'm fine with them moving on and just keep the search going... I'd like to think someone, someday will at least write one great book that can sit next to Fleming at his best... (no one say Colonel Sun, that's not it!)
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    Posts: 2,161
    I think COLONEL SUN is the strongest. It's not Fleming, and definitely not Fleming at his best, that won't happen. But it is very well written and it feels authentic to me, and it fits that slot nicely.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    It seems like Horowitz' third novel could associate itself with Colonel Sun in some way? They both seem to take place after TMWTGG... who knows.
    Haven't read Colonel Sun yet.
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