No Time to Die production thread (MINOR SPOILERS ALLOWED)

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  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 7,703
    this puts us closer to breaking the LTK- GE record gap. If that was a record we were hoping to break...

    Funny to think the gap between Craig's first and last Bond films will be the same as the gap between Dr No and The Spy Who Loved Me.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,700
    mtm wrote: »
    this puts us closer to breaking the LTK- GE record gap. If that was a record we were hoping to break...

    Funny to think the gap between Craig's first and last Bond films will be the same as the gap between Dr No and The Spy Who Loved Me.

    I was 4 when CR came out. I will be in my second year of college when NTTD *maybe* comes out
  • edited January 22 Posts: 331
    mtm wrote: »
    M:I is five weeks away, if it holds - that was why people were so worried about a potential shift to November. Halloween has become popular again, for sure. But not popular enough that I would worry about it eating into Bond's gross.

    I'm not sure why people are so concerned about these two movies potentially going head to head anyway.

    Even if we leave out the fact that NTTD is a finished movie and MI still has months of filming left and the fact that the schedule is still very unstable, Bond is still a bigger franchise than MI:7.

    If for some reason NTTD was moved to a competing release date, MI:7 would be more likely vacate it than Bond.

    I guess these films probably need more space than usual as they need to make sure they can recoup as much as possible, plus people will perhaps not be wanting to do lots of trips to the cinema and just pick one film to see.

    Exactly, that's why nobody needs to worry about these movies going head to head. The studios who make them won't want to cut into their profits by competing in a period when the market is in a bad place.

    It's also fairly likely that both films will be pushed back. NTTD possibly to December at the earliest but more likely to the Winter/Spring of next year, with MI:7 to the Spring/Summer.

    It took us a little over a year to hit the COVID peak at this point and I imagine the next year (or so) will be spent climbing down from it.

    Society will return to some degree of day-to-day normality in as much as COVID will become another seasonal illness like the flu and social distancing restrictions will cease.

    Although the economic impact will obviously be felt for much longer afterwards.
  • Posts: 3,084
    antovolk wrote: »
    km16 wrote: »
    That date is not gonna hold. Not falling for it this time. Way too much competition.

    Which films should we be worried about? The only ones I see are Dune and Halloween, and I think Dune is slightly handicapped by its simultaneous debut on HBOMax.

    Dune is very likely to be a traditional release again, FYI..competing for IMAX will be a factor

    Are they using Godzilla vs Kong as a sacrificial lamb with regards to HBO Max, then?

    Legendary (the production company behind both films) actually wanted to sell that to Netflix but WB kiboshed that deal... only to turn around and put it on their own service instead without warning. Apparently a traditional release for Dune is what's being negotiated for by Legendary to avoid a lawsuit between both companies - and probably a bargaining chip that let WB go through now with putting GvK on HBO Max (trailer is out Sunday)
  • edited January 22 Posts: 1,094
    A possible release date but not a probable one. If it does open in October we will all be required to wear masks and leave a gap between us and strangers for sure.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    edited January 22 Posts: 7,293
    Yeah, I'm calling EON's bluff on this one. Of all dates to choose from, this seems a strange one to pick. There is likely to be another wave of the virus hitting around Autumn. It may not be as deadly as the first two, but rising cases eventually turns into hospitals struggling to cope, and then shutdowns. Right now in the UK is probably the worse time of the pandemic, and I KNOW older people are not thinking about a trip to the cinema, this year at least.

    Another thing is competition October is filling up nicely, and don't forget theres a kingsman film set for September. And I don't think movies will perform as they normally would pre-pandemic. Normally a big film Bond will make between 30 - 40% of its gross on its opening weekend. I don't think that's possible for Bond 25 because seating will be distanced, and people won't all pile in the first few days. Instead, movies could play for months and have their return spread out. This is a problem because with MI:7 releasing in November, with a big marketing push, and will likely take all the attention away from Bond.

    Personally I think it's crazy to think about releasing Bond 25 in October when we are still fighting the virus tooth and nail in January. I think everyone will be happy if they can get limited contact with their families by Summer. I think heading to the cinema is still far down on peoples list of priorities. A Bond film released this October is doomed to fail, because as happened last year, people will travel around the country during summer (nothing stops the brits and their caravan holidays), the virus will incubate, and then come the beginning of Autumn cases will rise, and at the very least the fear of another lockdown will keep people out of theatres.

    This seems like more of a placeholder date, like the others, to give them some room to breathe and see what happens. It also doesn't make sense to celebrate the 59th when the 60th is only a few months away.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 3,031
    TripAces wrote: »
    Mr_Beach wrote: »
    This makes a lot of sense. Why release it in April when they can delay it half a year and release it when life is back to normal? This feels like the final delay.

    Yes, it will be. I was hoping to see it this summer. October seems...damn...just an eternity away, now.

    October for now. If this pandemic continues the way it is going, expect that date to be pushed back again. I said all along it would be April 2022, and the current signs don't prove me wrong. EON are just giving themselves breathing space again.

    +1!
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    Posts: 7,293
    @jetsetwilly is correct. Wonder Woman just released and made about 20% of what the original Wonder Woman made in 2017. If they go go through with this new October date the movie will probably fail to make 50% of SPECTREs earnings. Bond 25 is said to has an overall (after marketing) of 500+ million, and they will not make that money back in October. I hope they don't go ahead with this, because it could mean really rocks times ahead for the franchise. People don't understand that this movie is another Spy Who Loved Me, or Goldeneye in the sense that there is a lot riding on it. EON have been lucky in the past, in that when things look to be heading towards a precipice they have fought with chest-beating gusto. I fear however that this time the chickens could be coming home to roost, I dunno just a bad vibe I'm getting here. Something doesn't feel right. They have to push the release to 2022 if they are in with a chance then, if the movie is good, a miracle can happen, as always seems to with Bond, and the "build and they will come" natural law will take effect again. Alternatively, if they release at the wrong time, it can mean that six years of work resulted in failure. I hope this is another Spy, Goldeneye, Skyfall moment, but something tells me it's different...
  • Posts: 2,931
    Life may never fully return back to the normal we once remembered it pre 2020.

    That's the most pessimistic post I've read recently. Personally I don't believe that we all are wearing facemasks in 2030. Even the spanish flu died out.

  • Posts: 174
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Life may never fully return back to the normal we once remembered it pre 2020.

    That's the most pessimistic post I've read recently. Personally I don't believe that we all are wearing facemasks in 2030. Even the spanish flu died out.

    No but honestly speaking I don't see theatrical experiences going back to the 'norm' for several years at least.
  • Posts: 2,931
    Watching 'Tenet' here in August '20, was exactly how it would have been in 2019. In fact July, August and September everything here was almost "back to normal" before the 2nd wave hit in October.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    Posts: 7,293
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Watching 'Tenet' here in August '20, was exactly how it would have been in 2019. In fact July, August and September everything here was almost "back to normal" before the 2nd wave hit in October.

    And the movie still tanked. Exactly why Spring 2022 is safer than October 2021 for Bond 25. If the movie is to have any chance of "taking off" and making the 500 - 600 million it has to (or more), it can't be positioned as literally one of the first biggest tent poles people go and see (like Tenet was). Whoever opens first will take a major hit, likely. Spring 2022 looks safe, EON need to not rush things after waiting for so long. Do it right.
  • edited January 22 Posts: 174
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Watching 'Tenet' here in August '20, was exactly how it would have been in 2019. In fact July, August and September everything here was almost "back to normal" before the 2nd wave hit in October.

    Thats one place. Blockbusters depend on countless countries to break even, where those countries are all working at different speeds with vaccinations. And God knows if the mutating virus will delay things.
  • Posts: 2,931
    Exactly why Spring 2022 is safer than October 2021 for Bond 25. If the movie is to have any chance of "taking off" and making the 500 - 600 million it has to (or more), it can't be positioned as literally one of the first biggest tent poles people go and see (like Tenet was). Whoever opens first will take a major hit,.

    From my local deli to the entire airline industry, everyone has taken a beating financially because of Covid-19. Breaking even and clinging on is what its all about. But you are saying that NTTD (and the movie industry) has no intention of settling wih just that? NTTD 600 million? I'd say they'd better postpone to 2023 then.

    But an interesting game of chicken...this "whoever opens first" you mention. One thing we know.... there isn't going to be a whole lot of competition those weeks.

    Btw, Tenet tanked because it wasn't a blockbusting crowdpleaser. Bond is.
  • edited January 22 Posts: 174
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Exactly why Spring 2022 is safer than October 2021 for Bond 25. If the movie is to have any chance of "taking off" and making the 500 - 600 million it has to (or more), it can't be positioned as literally one of the first biggest tent poles people go and see (like Tenet was). Whoever opens first will take a major hit,.

    From my local deli to the entire airline industry, everyone has taken a beating financially because of Covid-19. Breaking even and clinging on is what its all about. But you are saying that NTTD (and the movie industry) has no intention of settling wih just that? NTTD 600 million? I'd say they'd better postpone to 2023 then.

    But an interesting game of chicken...this "whoever opens first" you mention. One thing we know.... there isn't going to be a whole lot of competition those weeks.

    Btw, Tenet tanked because it wasn't a blockbusting crowdpleaser. Bond is.

    Tenet tanked because it tried opening in the middle of a pandemic, mainly due to Nolan's ego, and the general audience felt it was not worth risking your life to see a movie when you can wait three months to watch it safely at home.

    They could have shown the second coming of Jesus Christ and the existence of God caught on camera and it would have tanked.
  • EmilioEmilio Palmyra, Nassau
    Posts: 175
    Anyone knows if the soundtrack will be delated as well? Thx

  • Posts: 174
    Emilio wrote: »
    Anyone knows if the soundtrack will be delated as well? Thx

    For sure.
  • Posts: 2,931
    km16 wrote: »
    Tenet tanked because it tried opening in the middle of a pandemic.
    In the middle? So it's almost all over? :-) All I am saying is, that more people would have seen it, if it wasn't so damn confusing and hard to follow. Of course Covid-19 had an impact on revenue as well.

  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    edited January 22 Posts: 7,293
    You are both describing how Bond 25 is likely to fail at the boxoffice, an outcome people like me are terrified by. If Bond is the first big hitter out of the gates it will likely fall victim to the same fate as Tenet and Wonder Woman 84. I don't know how you can say that one is more crowd pleasing than the other if they both end up with around the same boxoffice. Tenet made around 350 million, and if 500 - 600 for Bond 25 is a pipe-dream then what can we expect? If this movie LOSES money, it's not exactly good news, as MGM will likely fold like a cheap suitcase, as Bond revenue was keeping them afloat to begin with.

    If the movie releases in October it'll make less than half of Spectres 880 million. Thats about the same as Die Another Day in 2002.
  • I still think that if NTTD had come out when Tenet did, it would made more money purely because it's a Bond film (so people mostly know what to expect) and you wouldn't have to explain the concept of the film to persuade people to see it, unlike Tenet. It wouldn't have done as well as normally (because of the restricted seating and the pandemic) but I do feel that it would done significantly better than Tenet. Oh well, we'll never know now. 😐
  • Posts: 2,931
    Comparing NTTD to a movie that has 5,4 on IMDB and aired on streaming at the same time?
  • edited January 22 Posts: 1,094
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Life may never fully return back to the normal we once remembered it pre 2020.

    That's the most pessimistic post I've read recently. Personally I don't believe that we all are wearing facemasks in 2030. Even the spanish flu died out.

    There will come a point when Covid reached a level where we live with it rather than Eradicate it. However I am in agreement with the original post. I fear that we are not going to go back to global travel as it was for example for many years - and those who do travel are taking and making unnecessary risks to themselves and others.

    Fauci reckons some return of normality in winter (some, not all) dependent on the success of the vaccines; the WHO says no chance of herd immunity this year. The UK chief medical officer says some normality but dependent on vaccines success. In short we are not going to be going back to sitting on crowded tubes and standing at the bar in pubs for years I think. Well reach a relationship with Covid where we accept 30-50000 deaths a year maybe. We have to. It’s not going anywhere

    Personally I expect the virus to evolve to multiple strains to become resistant to the vaccine in a way that we all need to be vaccinated regularly.

    NTTD will therefore have a short window of opportunity to make the best of a bad situation.

    It will struggle to break even and I think we may not get a new bond film for many many years.

    I know this sounds pessimistic but I don’t see any other reality
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    edited January 22 Posts: 7,293
    Matt007 wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Life may never fully return back to the normal we once remembered it pre 2020.

    That's the most pessimistic post I've read recently. Personally I don't believe that we all are wearing facemasks in 2030. Even the spanish flu died out.

    It will struggle to break even and I think we may not get a new bond film for many many years.

    I know this sounds pessimistic but I don’t see any other reality

    This is the exact situation that I and many others have feared. That the fallout of this film will finish MGM, and that EON will be stuck in limbo for a number of years, perhaps eventually selling too. There will definitely be a lot of behind the scenes shuffling to come in the years ahead. And I think it's safe to say that we won't see another Bond film during Bidens presidency, after B25.
  • Posts: 174
    Matt007 wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Life may never fully return back to the normal we once remembered it pre 2020.

    That's the most pessimistic post I've read recently. Personally I don't believe that we all are wearing facemasks in 2030. Even the spanish flu died out.

    There will come a point when Covid reached a level where we live with it rather than Eradicate it. However I am in agreement with the original post. I fear that we are not going to go back to global travel as it was for example for many years - and those who do travel are taking and making unnecessary risks to themselves and others.

    Fauci reckons some return of normality in winter (some, not all) dependent on the success of the vaccines; the WHO says no chance of herd immunity this year. The UK chief medical officer says some normality but dependent on vaccines success. In short we are not going to be going back to sitting on crowded tubes and standing at the bar in pubs for years I think. Well reach a relationship with Covid where we accept 30-50000 deaths a year maybe. We have to. It’s not going anywhere

    Personally I expect the virus to evolve to multiple strains to become resistant to the vaccine in a way that we all need to be vaccinated regularly.

    NTTD will therefore have a short window of opportunity to make the best of a bad situation.

    It will struggle to break even and I think we may not get a new bond film for many many years.

    I know this sounds pessimistic but I don’t see any other reality

    We will get a new Bond film sooner than later after this but it likely won't be with MGM. Id say within' 4 years. Under any normal circumstances, Bond is a gold mine. Studios will fight tooth and nail for it for sure so the wait likely won't be too long.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited January 22 Posts: 4,422
    It's interesting that people think this will affect the franchise so much considering this is an issue all production companies and films are experiencing, and also that EON and the franchise itself has survived a lot more internal problems.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    edited January 22 Posts: 7,293
    Denbigh wrote: »
    It's interesting that people think this will affect the franchise so much considering this is an issue all production companies and films are experiencing, and also that EON and the franchise itself has survived a lot more internal problems.

    Yes, they certainly have a knack of weathering storms but, at some point the luck has to run out, and things can turn nasty. There have been certain times in the franchise history where EON, MGM and everyone else involved have known with resounding certainty "everything is on the line here" and they have somehow managed to make it a success. Live And Let Die, Spy, Goldeneye, Casino Royale and Skyfall. And this is like that again, except the stakes are bigger than ever. If the movie fails to covers its expenses, it'll be 6 years work down the drain, MGM will go belly up, they struggle to begin the ball rolling for a number of years, as the background deals take place. I suspect we won't see another film until Biden has left office.
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 497
    Denbigh wrote: »
    It's interesting that people think this will affect the franchise so much considering this is an issue all production companies and films are experiencing, and also that EON and the franchise itself has survived a lot more internal problems.

    Yes, they certainly have a knack of weathering storms but, at some point the luck has to run out, and things can turn nasty. There have been certain times in the franchise history where EON, MGM and everyone else involved have known with resounding certainty "everything is on the line here" and they have somehow managed to make it a success. Live And Let Die, Spy, Goldeneye, Casino Royale and Skyfall. And this is like that again, except the stakes are bigger than ever. If the movie fails to covers its expenses, it'll be 6 years work down the drain, MGM will go belly up, they struggle to begin the ball rolling for a number of years, as the background deals take place. I suspect we won't see another film until Biden has left office.

    Well, yeah. Even if they can hold the October date, from then on it will be only 3 years and a bit until Biden's successor is inaugurated. And they haven't consistently put out films in 3 year intervals for a long time, even without all the circumstances that come into it now.

    What I do not understand about these doom posts is that some of you seem to think, the Bond series could end with NTTD. We are in the golden age of previously established IP in films. For years now, there have been very few movies (and basically none in the budget regions we are talking about for Bond) made that weren't based on something. And on top of that everything gets re-booted and redone and what not all the time. They just announced an origin movie about Willy Wonka for crying out loud!
    Even if it all goes tits up for MGM and possibly even EON in the next 5 years, there is simply no way that a franchise with this type of established credentials just stops.
    We could then argue, whether those would be "real" Bond films. But there will be Bond films as long as there is a film industry.
  • Posts: 544
    Mr_Beach wrote: »
    This makes a lot of sense. Why release it in April when they can delay it half a year and release it when life is back to normal? This feels like the final delay.

    The problem is: there is no indication, that life will be back to normal in October.
    The release of a movie in October 2021 will be the same as a release in August 2020, when Tenet came out.

    So I'm 100% sure, that the movie will be postponed again, unless a miracle happens and there will be no more social distancing and masks in October. But I doubt it.

    So a Covid-Release without red carpet events, with reduced seating etc. - they could have done that last summer or this spring. They don't need October for that.
    BUT all these side events and meeting fans from all around the world in London etc. - that's what I wish to experience again with the premiere of NTTD. So I'm willing to wait until that is possible again.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 6,416
    antovolk wrote: »
    antovolk wrote: »
    km16 wrote: »
    That date is not gonna hold. Not falling for it this time. Way too much competition.

    Which films should we be worried about? The only ones I see are Dune and Halloween, and I think Dune is slightly handicapped by its simultaneous debut on HBOMax.

    Dune is very likely to be a traditional release again, FYI..competing for IMAX will be a factor

    Are they using Godzilla vs Kong as a sacrificial lamb with regards to HBO Max, then?

    Legendary (the production company behind both films) actually wanted to sell that to Netflix but WB kiboshed that deal... only to turn around and put it on their own service instead without warning. Apparently a traditional release for Dune is what's being negotiated for by Legendary to avoid a lawsuit between both companies - and probably a bargaining chip that let WB go through now with putting GvK on HBO Max (trailer is out Sunday)

    Thought as much. "We'll give you Dune if you give us Godzilla vs Kong." etc.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited January 22 Posts: 3,031
    This October release date feels like a placeholder to me. Previous delays were made with statements from MGM and EoN saying they wanted “the film to be seen by the wider audiences possible... we understand will be disappointing bla bla...”. Now feels like: “Let’s say uhm October but who knows what will happen”.
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