Prism. Are you being snooped on? Is this community under suspicion from the security services?

edited June 2013 in General Discussion Posts: 2,782
A story developing here in the UK. Apparently, the security services here have used an American snooping security service to get around UK privacy laws. Emails, telephone calls, web usage etc of British citizens have been recorded and reported upon.

In this day and age is this to be expected or do we stand our ground and fight for our civil liberties? My insurance company wants me to insert a black box in my car to track my travels as a selling point to obtain cheaper insurance. Is this all the start of 1984 society? Are we are living under the illusion that we are free men?

I don't believe that this is to keep us safe and to keep on eye on terrorist plots. We are being controlled and readied for a New World Order where we will have to conform or else. With natural resources dwindling, economies failing, political systems and revolutions nearly every day, are the powers that be doing this for our own good?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/prism-scandal-agency-to-reveal-us-links-shortly-after-claims-that-thousands-of-britons-may-have-been-spied-on-by-gchq-8650001.html

Comments

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    With all the tracking/surveillance and overall baseless snooping that has increased over the years, one does wonder if freedom is even in existence anymore. Technology and increased methods of communication are good innovations in part, but the cons have seemed to outweigh the positives.
  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    Yes, it's all very concerning. I thought that the Gestapo was wound up in 1945, but apparently I was wrong.
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    Oh no they'll find what I've been watching on certain websites but they're only meant to be for people a year older than me! :\">
  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    Oh, heaven forbid. well what did we expect? We are MI6 after all!
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Oh, heaven forbid. well what did we expect? We are MI6 after all!

    What do you mean? Me?
  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Oh, heaven forbid. well what did we expect? We are MI6 after all!

    What do you mean? Me?

    No, I mean about us being snooped on. As Bodo Lempke might have said, 'Just my little joke'.
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Oh, heaven forbid. well what did we expect? We are MI6 after all!

    What do you mean? Me?

    No, I mean about us being snooped on. As Bodo Lempke might have said, 'Just my little joke'.

    Oh right it's not right can they see us on Ipads, Ipods , and Iphones too?
  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Oh, heaven forbid. well what did we expect? We are MI6 after all!

    What do you mean? Me?

    No, I mean about us being snooped on. As Bodo Lempke might have said, 'Just my little joke'.

    Oh right it's not right can they see us on Ipads, Ipods , and Iphones too?

    I've no idea, but I imagine it's all too possible. It's like Orwell's 1984.
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Oh, heaven forbid. well what did we expect? We are MI6 after all!

    What do you mean? Me?

    No, I mean about us being snooped on. As Bodo Lempke might have said, 'Just my little joke'.

    Oh right it's not right can they see us on Ipads, Ipods , and Iphones too?

    I've no idea, but I imagine it's all too possible. It's like Orwell's 1984.

    'Faints' .
  • http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22836378


    Getting better by the minute...wikileaks to the power of ten lol.
  • Posts: 12,136
    Trust no one! B-)
  • Posts: 479
    Oh shut up about 1984, we should be grateful that we live in a society where we can choose our leaders and can say what we want (within reason) and do whatever we want (within reason) now if you're implying the government sets up these terrorists so they can take control of social life and communications, then you are a bunch of paranoid people. Be thankful you don't live in North Korea, or Syria.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Dancing at midnight under the BeBop Moon
    Posts: 11,756
    Ouch, Sammm04.

    Well, I understand many folks being horrified that so much of their personal info is tracked. But honestly, I am not surprised. Nor am I alarmed much. If I were working in a higher up position in the government, I would take advantage of every bit of technology I could to ensure that my country stays safe, informed, and one step ahead of everybody else as much as possible.

    Yes, it could be abused. But that is not obvious at this point in time (yes, somebody will jump on me for saying that), but I just don't want to buy into any paranoia or panic.

    Is anyone really surprised by this? I have always assumed (for decades) that our governments are spying like crazy.
  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    edited June 2013 Posts: 13,862
    Sammm04 wrote:
    Oh shut up about 1984, we should be grateful that we live in a society where we can choose our leaders and can say what we want (within reason) and do whatever we want (within reason) now if you're implying the government sets up these terrorists so they can take control of social life and communications, then you are a bunch of paranoid people. Be thankful you don't live in North Korea, or Syria.

    Does that give them the right to dissolve any last remaining civil liberties, though? That is what the blockleiters in Nazi Germany did. We fought a world war to overthrow an all-powerful state, now in peacetime its being foisted on us while the masses ignorantly watch The X Factor and Britain's Got Talent! So go get stuffed!
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited June 2013 Posts: 9,117
    Ouch, Sammm04.

    Well, I understand many folks being horrified that so much of their personal info is tracked. But honestly, I am not surprised. Nor am I alarmed much. If I were working in a higher up position in the government, I would take advantage of every bit of technology I could to ensure that my country stays safe, informed, and one step ahead of everybody else as much as possible.

    Yes, it could be abused. But that is not obvious at this point in time (yes, somebody will jump on me for saying that), but I just don't want to buy into any paranoia or panic.

    Is anyone really surprised by this? I have always assumed (for decades) that our governments are spying like crazy.

    Quite.

    I dont think the government is doing its job properly if it doesnt have departments who are able to contravene the law on occasion (rather like Swallow himself. They are not criminals but they will say drive at 80mph if they need to get somewhere in a hurry). We only have to look at Abu Hamza and his ilk to see what fools we are made to look by sticking strictly to the law.

    I would hope we have black ops depts that are tasked with just quietly taking these people out with a double tap to the head as if we rely on the legal process to protect us we are in trouble. I am sure the yanks do even if we are too lily livered these days.
  • edited June 2013 Posts: 4,622
    I am not suprised. I've always assumed intelligence agencies could access anything, unless one took all sorts of Bond-worthy counter precautions.
    Not optimum for privacy, but really how could it be otherwise?

    I would hope we have black ops depts that are tasked with just quietly taking these people out with a double tap to the head as if we rely on the legal process to protect us we are in trouble. I am sure the yanks do even if we are too lily livered these days.
    You really would enjoy the Remo Williams, Destroyer books. That's exactly what Remo and Cure do. :D

  • edited June 2013 Posts: 2,782
    As it stands, we the people, vote for our laws and we entrust this with a form of government that we vote for. If, we the people, have not voted for laws that allow unelected, unregulated people to have access to our lives, then that's wrong.

    There is an easy way around this to digital snooping, you simply input your details, names, dob, age, where you live, incorrectly every time you sign up to something. Just enough to suggest its still you, apparently in buggers up the bots and they can't nail you to being the same person, so you're filtered out.

  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    As it stands, we the people, vote for our laws and we entrust this with a form of government that we vote for. If, we the people, have not voted for laws that allow unelected, unregulated people to have access to our lives, then that's wrong.

    There is an easy way around this to digital snooping, you simply input your details, names, dob, age, where you live, incorrectly every time you sign up to something. Just enough to suggest its still you, apparently in buggers up the bots and they can't nail you to being the same person, so you're filtered out.

    Yes, well I think that they may have overstepped the mark somewhat, so I am in agreement with your first paragraph. On the second paragraph, this may be a way forward but I'm not tech-savvy enough to even attempt that!
  • edited June 2013 Posts: 4,622
    I am looking forward to seeing what kind of ruckus Congress might raise, in order to strengthen constitutional privacy provisions to keep bureaucrats and government types out of our lives.
    However, when it comes to the broader intelligence agencies operating behind the scenes, I think we have to be realistic.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 6,838
    Intelligence agencies operate within the law. That's why there are laws on all the intelligence agencies in democratic countries. Of course, for conspiracists it wouldn't be much fun and as the nature of Intel work is secracy, they're easy to pick on. the CIA under Bush obviously didn't help much, they were (ab)using loopholes in these laws and breaking international ones. But then again, the US only use international laws when it suits them, right?

    With agencies getting less funding every year they'll try to do as much snooping through digital means as possible. It's far cheaper to track email then it is to infiltrate a terrorist cell.

    If they were really as efficient as people fear how high would the bust-rate of crimes be?30 percent like now? or closer to 100?

    But, for those who really want to know, this site has been visited by at least one intelligence agency before...
  • Posts: 7,625
    timmer wrote:
    I am looking forward to seeing what kind of ruckus Congress might raise, in order to strengthen constitutional privacy provisions to keep bureaucrats and government types out of our lives.

    This being the same congress that voted AYE for all the measures that took away the same constitutional privacy provisions when Bush/Cheyney found them necessary because if you were against them you were against the US of A???

    Just checking. O:-)

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Dancing at midnight under the BeBop Moon
    edited June 2013 Posts: 11,756
    Yes ... the same country that incorporated Nixon and his entire gang with their lovely escapades.

    (Which is my country, by the way.)
  • edited June 2013 Posts: 4,622
    Such cynicism here :) Anyway I am trying to make the distinction between visible and identifiable government authorities rooting through our communications and the invisible agencies that might do the same thing.
    Congress can at least make efforts to uphold 4th amendment provisions in the case of the former. Their activities can be audited etc.
    As for the latter; realistically if it's traceable it's accessible - to those that have the capacity to trace, legally or legalishly. I don't think there's much that can be done about this. It's the reality of world we live in.
    We all watch enough tv and movies to know this.

    ==Update: Nothing to fear. The President has said that, "In the years to come," he would be "reviewing the authorities of law enforcement, so we can intercept new types of communication," but that he would "build in privacy protections to prevent abuse" and have a "strong Privacy and Civil Liberties Board to review those issues where our counterterrorism efforts and our values may come into tension."

    There, all is well. The President is looking out for us. O:-)



  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited June 2013 Posts: 9,117
    Yeah this side of the pond Cameron said “that they operate in a way that is proper and that is fitting” so its alright you see.

    I'm glad hes cleared it all up.
  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    Yeah this side of the pond Cameron said “that they operate in a way that is proper and that is fitting” so its alright you see.

    I'm glad hes cleared it all up.

    Crystal clear...erm...as mud?

  • DragonpolDragonpol The Crazy World of David Dragonpol
    Posts: 13,862
    Oh no they'll find what I've been watching on certain websites but they're only meant to be for people a year older than me! :\">

    Perhaps you're too young for here, too? I could be right!
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 6,838
    Ha, thankfully, peace in our time!
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