Would you rather we refer to the next film as Bond26 OR Amazon1?

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Comments

  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 14,796
    That's well said @BT3366 and would be ideal for me.


    SF opening if it had a gunbarrel start. Gunbarrel indicates Bond shot a bad guy. Bond walks into focus, continues down the corridor to find an associate. Obviously 007 didn't shoot fellow agent Ronson. So there's not an automatic conflict there.

    The first gunbarrel for an actor can be ambiguous as mentioned earlier (Bob Simmons as Connery in DN, FRWL, GF) or clearly the actor Connery, Lazenby, Moore, Dalton, Brosnan, and Craig.

    The Bond actor will be known at the time of the film's release, on posters and trailers. I'll be looking to recognize the actor in the Bond role at first opportunity on screen. And that moment will establish him to audiences, gunbarrel or otherwise. My thinking is for BOND 26 the gunbarrel demands a clear introduction of the new Bond, from there it will be film history regardless.

  • Posts: 12,878
    cooperman2 wrote: »
    At the start. Always. It's the few seconds that let you know this isn't some bog standard action movie this is a JAMES BOND film.

    +1
  • Posts: 2,464
    Right now I don't care. It's just a brand. I guess Amazon will use it as such.

  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 6,165
    I never really bought the reason for no GB at the start for Skyfall. To me there was ways to have it and have Bond come into focus down the corridor.

    The thrill of the music hitting as the dots move across the screen is unlike anything else in cinema. I would argue that Star Wars comes close with the "Galaxy far far away..." John Williams music hits.

    Bring it back, respect it, update it if you want. But let have a bombastic start to the film and the GB gets us going.
  • edited October 13 Posts: 6,125
    I think the opening of SF makes sense as it is. It’s very much a ‘start as late as possible’ beginning, which in storytelling terms is ideal. The opening shot from a cinematic perspective is pretty damn ingenious too (such a simple, elegant way of introducing Bond, and the shape of the lighting even emphasises Craig’s eyes, which is one of his most striking features. It works better than any insert or establishing shot).

    I can also understand how it just feels ‘off’ having the gunbarrel at the start and then introducing Bond like that. What’s the point in introducing him twice? I think as fans we love the idea of the gunbarrel so much we wouldn’t always notice just how weird it’d feel to most viewers. And honestly, if that was a choice that was agreed upon by all the talented creatives who made this film, I’ll trust them. No, they made the right choice, and it actually works well having it at the end after showing us the traditional MI6 office and Bond returning (hell, I’d argue it lessens the impact of the ending not having it there!) I think it’d be equally as awful losing that wonderful feeling of the ending as well just because of ‘tradition’.
  • Posts: 2,146
    007HallY wrote: »
    I can also understand how it just feels ‘off’ having the gunbarrel at the start and then introducing Bond like that. What’s the point in introducing him twice?

    The producers didn't have a problem with introducing Bond twice in TWINE. Gun barrel and then film opens right on Bond.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,375
    I do tend to think that’s the worst transition in the series though. That and maybe OHMSS compete for the least exciting shot for the gunbarrel to open on.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 7,010
    mtm wrote: »
    I do tend to think that’s the worst transition in the series though. That and maybe OHMSS compete for the least exciting shot for the gunbarrel to open on.

    You don't like radioactive lint?
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 6,165
    "When placed in an opponents pocket the anti-personal and location fix seems fairly obvious. @007HallY is making ugly noises about Operation Gun Barrel."

    Sorry couldn't resist.

    I do think there was a way, not sure if it would have been better or taken away from what we got. I just didn't see the need for SF to have no gun barrel.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 7,010
    thedove wrote: »
    "When placed in an opponents pocket the anti-personal and location fix seems fairly obvious. @007HallY is making ugly noises about Operation Gun Barrel."

    Sorry couldn't resist.

    I do think there was a way, not sure if it would have been better or taken away from what we got. I just didn't see the need for SF to have no gun barrel.

    I blame Mendes.
  • Posts: 16,742
    I remember an ABC edit of OHMSS where the red circle of the gunbarrel faded into the Universal Exports sign rather than opening on it.
    I always thought a transition like that might've worked for SF as the initial image is out of focus.
    Honestly, I never really cared for the opening shot of SF. It's okay, but I prefer the opening shots of all the other Craig films.
  • edited October 14 Posts: 6,125
    thedove wrote: »
    "When placed in an opponents pocket the anti-personal and location fix seems fairly obvious. @007HallY is making ugly noises about Operation Gun Barrel."


    Sorry couldn't resist.

    I do think there was a way, not sure if it would have been better or taken away from what we got. I just didn't see the need for SF to have no gun barrel.
    .

    Hehe 😂

    fjdinardo wrote: »
    007HallY wrote: »
    I can also understand how it just feels ‘off’ having the gunbarrel at the start and then introducing Bond like that. What’s the point in introducing him twice?

    The producers didn't have a problem with introducing Bond twice in TWINE. Gun barrel and then film opens right on Bond.

    TWINE’s PTS isn’t exactly as cinematic as SF’s (a polite way of saying not as good). It’s also not really an introduction to Bond. He’s just walking across the street. SF’s opening is a full intro, him coming into focus, into the light etc. Different feel even though both open with a shot of Bond.

    I think at the end of the day it just came down to impact. It lessens the impact of the opening shot seeing the gunbarrel beforehand, and instead of reshooting they realised putting it at the end heightened the finale. Pretty elegant solution I’d say that made an emotionally satisfying film.
  • Posts: 16,161
    007HallY wrote: »
    thedove wrote: »
    "When placed in an opponents pocket the anti-personal and location fix seems fairly obvious. @007HallY is making ugly noises about Operation Gun Barrel."


    Sorry couldn't resist.

    I do think there was a way, not sure if it would have been better or taken away from what we got. I just didn't see the need for SF to have no gun barrel.
    .

    Hehe 😂

    fjdinardo wrote: »
    007HallY wrote: »
    I can also understand how it just feels ‘off’ having the gunbarrel at the start and then introducing Bond like that. What’s the point in introducing him twice?

    The producers didn't have a problem with introducing Bond twice in TWINE. Gun barrel and then film opens right on Bond.

    TWINE’s PTS isn’t exactly as cinematic as SF’s (a polite way of saying not as good). It’s also not really an introduction to Bond. He’s just walking across the street. SF’s opening is a full intro, him coming into focus, into the light etc. Different feel even though both open with a shot of Bond.

    I think at the end of the day it just came down to impact. It lessens the impact of the opening shot seeing the gunbarrel beforehand, and instead of reshooting they realised putting it at the end heightened the finale. Pretty elegant solution I’d say that made an emotionally satisfying film.

    Can't say the PTS of TWINE is a good introduction of Bond into the movie, in any case. I can't think of any worse ones, right off the bat.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,375
    Yeah, doing it on a long lens as he crosses the street is a bit of a weird introduction, as the first shot of the film it's kind of baffling.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 6,165
    Yeah, They maybe should have done a FRWL or GF thing where the dot disappears and the movie opens.

    I think TB started the dot landing on something of interest and then opening up on the scene. OHMSS opens up on Universal Exports sign with Peter Hunt strolling across. I love that Easter Egg.
  • Posts: 6,125
    Ludovico wrote: »
    007HallY wrote: »
    thedove wrote: »
    "When placed in an opponents pocket the anti-personal and location fix seems fairly obvious. @007HallY is making ugly noises about Operation Gun Barrel."


    Sorry couldn't resist.

    I do think there was a way, not sure if it would have been better or taken away from what we got. I just didn't see the need for SF to have no gun barrel.
    .

    Hehe 😂

    fjdinardo wrote: »
    007HallY wrote: »
    I can also understand how it just feels ‘off’ having the gunbarrel at the start and then introducing Bond like that. What’s the point in introducing him twice?

    The producers didn't have a problem with introducing Bond twice in TWINE. Gun barrel and then film opens right on Bond.

    TWINE’s PTS isn’t exactly as cinematic as SF’s (a polite way of saying not as good). It’s also not really an introduction to Bond. He’s just walking across the street. SF’s opening is a full intro, him coming into focus, into the light etc. Different feel even though both open with a shot of Bond.

    I think at the end of the day it just came down to impact. It lessens the impact of the opening shot seeing the gunbarrel beforehand, and instead of reshooting they realised putting it at the end heightened the finale. Pretty elegant solution I’d say that made an emotionally satisfying film.

    Can't say the PTS of TWINE is a good introduction of Bond into the movie, in any case. I can't think of any worse ones, right off the bat.

    I suppose the one thing you can say about it is it's such a bland shot that it doesn't even register as an introduction (it's also kind of voyeuristic but in a surveilance-like way. You're almost expecting a camera to click and a photo to be taken of Bond). Hence why the gunbarrel is absolutely fine coming before.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 4,529
    It's one of my few complaints about the Craig era. They messed around with the gun-barrel too much.
  • edited October 14 Posts: 6,125
    I'd say my biggest problem with Craig's gun barrels is their execution. The CR one is awesome. The QOS one looks sped up and Craig's posture isn't great. The SF one's fine. I really don't like the design of the SP one (it looks as though it's been done on After Effects as a very basic mock up. I understand it's a nod to the early gun barrels, but for a modern film it sticks out). That and Craig swings his gun around. The NTTD one was pretty awesome.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited October 14 Posts: 19,375
    I've never minded the gun swinging about, I don't notice it. And his firing pose is so great I think it might be my favourite of the lot: it's perfect. My only issue with that one is I wish it just opened up in the normal way, I don't think the caption adds anything.
    The NTTD one does look great though, and if they continued the way it transitions to the film in the next one I wouldn't be upset (I don't actually miss the blood all that much).

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  • Ugh I hated the gun swinging. The very least Craig could’ve done during those sequences was keep the gun hidden instead of swinging it around as if it was some toy - adding a sort of “parody” like quality to it. If I was that sniper and I saw Bond swinging that gun like that you can bet that I’d be shooting him before he has a chance to shoot me.

    Brosnan still has the best Gunbarrel design, walk, and final pose of all the actors who’ve done the sequence but I do like the Bob Simmons version as well as Moore’s first version of the sequence as well.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited October 14 Posts: 19,375
    I've never been that keen on Brosnan's pigeon-chested one: I think it always looks better if they bend their knees for the shot and he just stays completely ramrod straight.

    For me Dalton was always tops, with Roger's second one coming just after (that guy did know how to strike a pose); but nowadays it's Craig's Spectre one.

    77f4ed99c5cc5450beb638b9e005d27f.gif
  • Posts: 6,125
    Doesn't Rog miss the shot on his first gunbarrel? I remember his gun was askew. The flairs in his second one I feel lasted a bit too long into the 80s!

    I like Brosnan's stances. Very much a head shot, haha.

    Craig's last two poses are very aesthetically pleasing.
  • edited October 14 Posts: 2,696
    mtm wrote: »
    I've never been that keen on Brosnan's pigeon-chested one: I think it always looks better if they bend their knees for the shot and he just stays completely ramrod straight.

    For me Dalton was always tops, with Roger's second one coming just after (that guy did know how to strike a pose); but nowadays it's Craig's Spectre one.

    77f4ed99c5cc5450beb638b9e005d27f.gif

    The Brosnan one just oozes “professional killer” for me - like he was making that shot with minimal effort required on his part - the sharp way with which he turns and fires is just so smooth too - it felt like Brosnan wasn’t overthinking that sequence whereas the other sequences just don’t feel that effortless in the walk and final pose. To my eyes Brosnan’s sequence was the gunbarrel sequence perfected which is why I never got bothered with the CR gunbarrel when it was so radically different than what had come before. I actually think it would’ve been pretty cool if all of Craig’s Gunbarrels were like the CR one - granted you’d have to create some scenario that would call for Bond killing a thug like that in each film but it would’ve been stylistically nice having all of Craig’s Gunbarrel be similar to his first Gunbarrels sequence - and it’d fit in with his era already drastically shaking things up and being more down to earth.
    007HallY wrote: »
    Doesn't Rog miss the shot on his first gunbarrel? I remember his gun was askew. The flairs in his second one I feel lasted a bit too long into the 80s!

    I like Brosnan's stances. Very much a head shot, haha.

    Craig's last two poses are very aesthetically pleasing.

    He does! When he turns and fires the gun he’s accidentally aiming more towards the right of the camera set-up. It’s a goof admittedly but I still love that final pose - it’s a lot more confident and looks better than Connery’s pose during the sequence
  • edited October 14 Posts: 6,125
    mtm wrote: »
    I've never been that keen on Brosnan's pigeon-chested one: I think it always looks better if they bend their knees for the shot and he just stays completely ramrod straight.

    For me Dalton was always tops, with Roger's second one coming just after (that guy did know how to strike a pose); but nowadays it's Craig's Spectre one.

    77f4ed99c5cc5450beb638b9e005d27f.gif

    The Brosnan one just oozes “professional killer” for me - like he was making that shot with minimal effort required on his part - the sharp way with which he turns and fires is just so smooth too - it felt like Brosnan wasn’t overthinking that sequence whereas the other sequences just don’t feel that effortless in the walk and final pose. To my eyes Brosnan’s sequence was the gunbarrel sequence perfected which is why I never got bothered with the CR gunbarrel when it was so radically different than what had come before. I actually think it would’ve been pretty cool if all of Craig’s Gunbarrels were like the CR one - granted you’d have to create some scenario that would call for Bond killing a thug like that in each film but it would’ve been stylistically nice having all of Craig’s Gunbarrel be similar to his first Gunbarrels sequence - and it’d fit in with his era already drastically shaking things up and being more down to earth.
    007HallY wrote: »
    Doesn't Rog miss the shot on his first gunbarrel? I remember his gun was askew. The flairs in his second one I feel lasted a bit too long into the 80s!

    I like Brosnan's stances. Very much a head shot, haha.

    Craig's last two poses are very aesthetically pleasing.

    He does! When he turns and fires the gun he’s accidentally aiming more towards the right of the camera set-up. It’s a goof admittedly but I still love that final pose - it’s a lot more confident and looks better than Connery’s pose during the sequence

    To be fair I always question whether they froze the frame later on Connery's gun barrel compared to the others (he seems to wobble, and it's not an easy pose to keep leaning forward like that. No idea one way or the other though).

    The older gun barrels are quite funny rewatching certain films. Obviously they didn't re-film them each time as they did with the Craig era, so you get Moore wearing flairs into the 80s, or Connery wearing a hat in '71.

    Lazenby's is the weirdest one. A weird treadmill effect with the gun barrel not quite keeping up with his walk.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,375
    Yeah I've no idea why Maurice slippy-slid him across the screen, really weird.

    I guess we do all agree that, as great a Bond as he was, Connery's gunbarrel ranks towards the bottom end of the spectrum!
  • edited October 14 Posts: 6,125
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I've no idea why Maurice slippy-slid him across the screen, really weird.

    I'm going to guess because George walked too quickly. So in post the gun barrel had to stop at points creating the tread mill effect.
  • I always like to call Lazenby’s sequence “The Moonwalker!”
  • Posts: 848
    007HallY wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I've no idea why Maurice slippy-slid him across the screen, really weird.

    I'm going to guess because George walked too quickly. So in post the gun barrel had to stop at points creating the tread mill effect.

    I'm not sure why they didn't just refilm it.
  • Posts: 6,125
    007HallY wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I've no idea why Maurice slippy-slid him across the screen, really weird.

    I'm going to guess because George walked too quickly. So in post the gun barrel had to stop at points creating the tread mill effect.

    I'm not sure why they didn't just refilm it.

    Because they probably didn’t realise until it got to post production much later on. I mean, it’s at the very least a money saving way of salvaging it. Not like anyone was going to rewatch the film multiple times at home and pick up on it!
  • Posts: 2,464
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I've no idea why Maurice slippy-slid him across the screen, really weird.

    I guess we do all agree that, as great a Bond as he was, Connery's gunbarrel ranks towards the bottom end of the spectrum!

    It's my favorite gun barrel. The pose is perfect. He shoots like a cowboy.


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