No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • matt_u wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    TDKR didn't felt like an ambiguous ending to me. Bruce left with Selina leaving his legacy in the hands of Blake. The whole point of the movie was "Batman can be anyone" so Wayne's decision to disappear faking his death seemed coherent with this whole theme, especially because fulfilled Alfred's desire to see him leaving a normal life leaving Gotham forever. Plus, Nolan films has been always conceived as a self-contained trilogy with a begin, a middle and an end.
    Actually that's not really true. The Nolan Bat films were never originally devised as a trilogy. They made it up as they went along, which makes what he achieved with them all the more remarkable.

    They did in fact keep the last one ambiguous. There was for a time a chance that Bale could return, but he said he'd only do it if Nolan came back too, and that didn't happen. It's true that they brought in Blake, but once again it could have been as a future Robin for all we know. Things were kept vague. Moreover, Wayne was in hiding for 8 years prior anyway, as was Batman. He returned in the last one because of the League of Shadows and so one could argue that they left open the prospect that he could do so once again.

    If you go back and read the discussion on this thread from a couple of years ago (prior to Craig announcing his return), you will see that quite a few members saw the SP ending as similar to the TDKR finale, at least in terms of the ambiguous nature of his leaving with his girl to settle down to a life away from solving the world's problems after defeating the organization that caused him so much trouble.

    Let's put it this way. After the success of BB and TDK, Rises was conceived as an ideal thematic ending of Nolan's Trilogy. I never thought about a possible fourth Nolan film simply because Wayne's story arc was completely fulfilled in Rises. Maybe he'd do another one in 10 years, with a super old Batman. That's the reason why the ending didn't felt ambiguous to me. In SP was different, because Bond left on a similar OHMSS fashion plus the big baddie of his era was still alive. So to me SP finale felt far more open than Rises. I'd say that SP finale felt exactly like the TDK finale - even if the implications are obviously different - in which Joker was left alive and Batman decided to quit his "job".

    Given the fact that 25 will be 99,9% Craig's last, now I predict they'd go for a more Rises route than, for example, a Logan route.

    Totally agree.

    TDKR was clearly Nolan’s rather earnest (and faltered) attempt to tie up the trilogy. There was a clear attempt to bring a conclusion to Bruce Wayne’s arc.

    SP always left a number of loose ends. The principle ones being Blofeld and Madeleine. Each time I saw the film there was a general sense walking out of the theatres from audiences that Blofeld would return and kill Madeleine and Bond would go for revenge, blah blah blah blah.

    If Eon really go down the route of bringing back Blofeld, I really hope they avoid this angle. Plus, it’ll be close to 5 years by the time Bond 25 comes out, who even wants to remember such a middling Bond film as SP by then? Let the film fade away.

    The world has changed in such a profound way since 2015. Arguably we haven’t had a more interesting time since Putin began his quest to become a real life Bond villain. Why waste your time on regurgitating SP? The moment has come and gone.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    FoxRox wrote: »
    It’s been years since SP, and given the series’ history, there’s no reason for them to feel tied to any previous continuity. It’d be unwise I think not to take advantage of that clean slate.
    Quite right.
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    Just a thought of ending B25. It would never happen but the towards the end Bond receives a message from Strangways about coming down to Jamaica to do some fishing and how he has a matter to discuss with Bond regarding a mysterious island.

    Full circle

    That sounds incredible! I would love that!
  • Bond dying is not something that interests me.

    I just want a Bond movie that feels surprising and dynamic (like Skyfall and CR), instead of just going through the motions ploddingly (Spectre). A movie that looks great and has memorable elements (mainly a memorable villain).

    They just need that element to bring some degree of freshness to the proceedings (in CR it was Bond becoming 007, in SF it was trials and tribulations of M). I get the sense brothergate was supposed this element in SP but it failed to me. That doesn't mean they can't try something else this time around though.
  • RemingtonRemington I'll do anything for a woman with a knife.
    edited September 2018 Posts: 1,532
    I'm surprised at the love for Madeleine. I couldn't stand her or Seydoux's performance for that matter. Also, I'm just being a prick here, but I didn't even find her attractive apart from during the dinner scene on the train. She's just too ordinary looking. The same could be said of Maryam d'Abo but I don't wanna speak against @barryt007 woman.

    At least Kara had chemistry with Dalton. More than I can say for Craig and Seydoux.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Remington wrote: »
    I'm surprised at the love for Madeleine. I couldn't stand her or Seydoux's performance for that matter. Also, I'm just being a prick here, but I didn't even find her attractive apart from during the dinner scene on the train. She's just too ordinary looking. The same could be said of Maryam d'Abo but I don't wanna speak against @barryt007 woman.

    At least Kara had chemistry with Dalton. More than I can say for Craig and Seydoux.
    Pretty much.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    Red_Snow wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Waltz could redeem himself, he was horribly misused; Seydoux, on the other hand was miscast and should not be brought back.

    I thought Waltz gave such a blank performance in SP. He sleepwalked through the film and collected the cheque. I think it was clear that Mendes and Waltz wanted to do something more subtle and quieter with Blofeld (after the flamboyance of Silva in SF). But it just came across as limp and disinteresting.

    Waltz implied that he and Mendes had differing ideas for the character. Which is seemingly quite clear from the two different versions of the same speech used in the teasers/trailers.

    Indeed, given another crack at I think he would have a different take on the role; any difference
    In his personality and behavior could be attributed to the injuries sustained in SP.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,050
    talos7 wrote: »
    Red_Snow wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Waltz could redeem himself, he was horribly misused; Seydoux, on the other hand was miscast and should not be brought back.

    I thought Waltz gave such a blank performance in SP. He sleepwalked through the film and collected the cheque. I think it was clear that Mendes and Waltz wanted to do something more subtle and quieter with Blofeld (after the flamboyance of Silva in SF). But it just came across as limp and disinteresting.

    Waltz implied that he and Mendes had differing ideas for the character. Which is seemingly quite clear from the two different versions of the same speech used in the teasers/trailers.

    Indeed, given another crack at I think he would have a different take on the role; any difference
    In his personality and behavior could be attributed to the injuries sustained in SP.

    How about giving him a gold tooth like in YOLT? That would be a true homage.
  • DCisaredDCisared Liverpool
    Posts: 1,329
    It does irritate me that the reason Mendes directed Spectre was because he felt like he had some weird ownership over Mallory, Q and Moneypenny. Judge the situation dispassionately for god sakes man.

    Be interesting to see how much we get (if any at all) of Madeleine And Blofeld and if we don't, if both characters we're included in earlier drafts.

    'Fuku' must like the story though which has me excited AF
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,050
    DCisared wrote: »
    It does irritate me that the reason Mendes directed Spectre was because he felt like he had some weird ownership over Mallory, Q and Moneypenny. Judge the situation dispassionately for god sakes man.

    Be interesting to see how much we get (if any at all) of Madeleine And Blofeld and if we don't, if both characters we're included in earlier drafts.

    'Fuku' must like the story though which has me excited AF

    Not to mention Mr. Hinx, possibly. Maybe we'll get his first name.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Just a thought of ending B25. It would never happen but the towards the end Bond receives a message from Strangways about coming down to Jamaica to do some fishing and how he has a matter to discuss with Bond regarding a mysterious island.

    Full circle

    I love this idea so much that I might be disappointed if it won't be used (and it probably won't).
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 4,619
    echo wrote: »
    "Killing off" the main character didn't work in the Batman trilogy either. There was no drama in it; you just knew he was alive. (Hint: no studio is going to kill the golden goose.)
    They could have easily killed him at the end of Nolan's trilogy, without killing the golden goose. One word: reboot.
    Just a thought of ending B25. It would never happen but the towards the end Bond receives a message from Strangways about coming down to Jamaica to do some fishing and how he has a matter to discuss with Bond regarding a mysterious island.

    Full circle

    I hate to say this but that actually sounds kinda genius
    I'm not sure sure. The Jamaica mission is obviously one of Bond's earliest missions. Bond at the end of Bond 25 should be either retired or close to retiring.
  • Goldeneye0094Goldeneye0094 Conyers, GA
    Posts: 464
    I'm not 100% for the idea of setting up dr no at the end of bond 25 on paper it sounds cool and inventive but I don't execution wise it would work in the craig era

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I'm not 100% for the idea of setting up dr no at the end of bond 25 on paper it sounds cool and inventive but I don't execution wise it would work in the craig era
    I agree. Best not to go here imho.
  • Posts: 1,548
    M to Bond Ever heard of an American called Ethan Hunt?

    Bond to M. Yes. Rather cocky but quite daring. Does all his own stunts apparently.Can be quite reckless at times but a good man to have on your side.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,656
    How about...playing "Three Blind Mice" over the closing credits....? [ducks and runs]
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    A dubstep version of it, perhaps.

    You know... aimed at the modern audience.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,009
    The February 2020 DC flick is confirmed as Birds of Prey, and will release one week before Bond 25 on February 7.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited September 2018 Posts: 12,459
    Keep MI and references to it as far away as another universe. Ugh.

    As for the script, I am more confident than ever now because Cary is on board. He is a very good writer. He will contribute as it goes along, and that is reassuring to me.

    I'm happy with a Jamaica reference. I think the dialog should be quite good with this next one. We have a director who is not only stunning with visuals, including action, but also a writer. He will have his own vision moving forward. He can take whatever is given to him, and work with the writers and actors, and give us a top notch Bond film. I have more confidence in Cary than in any previous director coming along, since I can remember.
  • Posts: 9,730
    As huge a Batman fan I am I must admit I am only vaguely interested in birds of prey though I am more interested in that then the stupid Joker movie
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    LeChiffre wrote: »
    M to Bond Ever heard of an American called Ethan Hunt?

    Bond to M. Yes. Rather cocky but quite daring. Does all his own stunts apparently.Can be quite reckless at times but a good man to have on your side.

    I know you only mean it in jest but realise there are those out there that can't stand Tom Cruise and don't even think Ethan Hunt should be mentioned in the same sentence as Bond.

    I know I'm in a minority but I'm sick to the back teeth of bloody Mission Impossible.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    Had the Craig era been mapped out, and executed with a better sense of purpose and direction, a conclusion that mentions Dr No could have been poetic.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 12,914
    The February 2020 DC flick is confirmed as Birds of Prey, and will release one week before Bond 25 on February 7.
    I like the sound of that.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 4,400
    talos7 wrote: »
    Had the Craig era been mapped out, and executed with a better sense of purpose and direction, a conclusion that mentions Dr No could have been poetic.

    Didn't they already do that?

    I mean Bond's last scene of CR is evocative of Bond's first scene in DN. You don't need anymore than that.

    It's the moment he becomes James Bond, essentially the character we met in DN.

    Also, the end of SF is pretty much a remake of DN and Bond's meeting with M. I even recall reading an interview with Mendes where he says that you could put on DN straight after the film's could play on loop from then on.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 3,333
    Just a thought of ending B25. It would never happen but the towards the end Bond receives a message from Strangways about coming down to Jamaica to do some fishing and how he has a matter to discuss with Bond regarding a mysterious island.

    Full circle
    That's a bloody perfect ending @Last_Rat_Standing, and I mean it. I'd pay good money just to see that pre-post-credits scene. You should've been at the recent script spitball meeting. I just hope someone from Eon reads this and goes: "You know what? That's a better ending than the one we've got. Let's go with Last Rat's idea." Also, credit to @AgentM72 for improving and expanding upon the idea.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Shardlake wrote: »
    LeChiffre wrote: »
    M to Bond Ever heard of an American called Ethan Hunt?

    Bond to M. Yes. Rather cocky but quite daring. Does all his own stunts apparently.Can be quite reckless at times but a good man to have on your side.

    I know you only mean it in jest but realise there are those out there that can't stand Tom Cruise and don't even think Ethan Hunt should be mentioned in the same sentence as Bond.

    I know I'm in a minority but I'm sick to the back teeth of bloody Mission Impossible.

    +1
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Walecs wrote: »
    Shardlake wrote: »
    LeChiffre wrote: »
    M to Bond Ever heard of an American called Ethan Hunt?

    Bond to M. Yes. Rather cocky but quite daring. Does all his own stunts apparently.Can be quite reckless at times but a good man to have on your side.

    I know you only mean it in jest but realise there are those out there that can't stand Tom Cruise and don't even think Ethan Hunt should be mentioned in the same sentence as Bond.

    I know I'm in a minority but I'm sick to the back teeth of bloody Mission Impossible.

    +1

    +2.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,586
    The February 2020 DC flick is confirmed as Birds of Prey, and will release one week before Bond 25 on February 7.
    Screwed over by DC yet again...
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    jake24 wrote: »
    The February 2020 DC flick is confirmed as Birds of Prey, and will release one week before Bond 25 on February 7.
    Screwed over by DC yet again...
    I think this is the new Harley Quinn flick. It's supposed to have Black Canary and Huntress in it too. Depending on casting and script, it could do reasonably big business stateside.
  • MrBondMrBond Station S
    Posts: 2,044
    Actually, the first draft by Richard Maibaum and MGW for TLD was supposed to be a pure origin story of Bond (including a meeting between Bond and his uncle in his childhood home in Scotland). It would also include the previous 007 who would've sacrifice himself in the line of duty.

    However, that particular script ends with Bond being sent to M after a night out to investigate the case of a disappeared man called Strangways..
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