No Time To Die - Awards Chatter, Nominations and Results

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  • 00Heaven00Heaven Home
    Posts: 573
    Jimjambond wrote: »
    00Heaven wrote: »
    My take on the "It's a G.I. Jane joke" is that Rock knew what he was doing but he didn't have to. He wanted Smith to look small and stupid but didn't realise that Smith already achieved that to 50% of people by reacting in the way that he did. Obviously to the other 50% they'll agree with his reaction.

    I haven't watched the Oscars but it looked like he was roasting Cruz/Bardem before it cut to Smith/Jada. If he was roasting them for their appearance then I would say that invalidates him saying it's just a G.I Jane joke because then his small routine was completely about roasting appearances.

    EDIT: Also thank God Ricky Gervais wasn't hosting. There'd have been a brawl lol.

    He wasn't roasting Bardem or Cruz' appearance. He made a harmless joke about there being trouble in paradise if Penelope didn't win and Bardem did. It was a harmless clean joke. As for the Smiths, the real bizarre thing is that Rock's joke wasn't even an insult. Jada usually has hair. This is the first time she's publicly come out without any hair and all he said was looking forward to seeing her in GI Jane 2. I'm sorry but getting emotionally upset over such a remark is ridiculous, talk less of attacking the man for it.

    If you look closely, the joke came and went and the audience only was only escalated their laughter when Jada visibly rolled her eyes and then seconds later Jada gaslights Mr "emasculated-man in crisis big Willy" goes up and needlessly slaps him for it.

    Chris Rock did nothing wrong. Meanwhile we have a whole thread here dedicated to Daniel Craig’s hair been ridiculed for receding etc. The mental gymnastics, fake virtue signalling and oversensitive snowflake society in which we live in is deeply concerning.

    That's why I said if in my original post. I didn't know because I didn't watch the whole thing. I just saw them cut from them laughing. It was to try and attempt to give an explanation as to why he may have said that. If you read my prior posts you would know I don't defend Smith's actions at all and Rock didn't deserve such a disproportionate response.

    Rock's still a crap comedian for going for the low hanging fruit, but carry on.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,372
    Venutius wrote: »
    As for 'keep my wife's name out of your mouth' - bit rich considering she's spent years telling the media about all the other people who've put things in her mouth while she's been married to Will. If only Chris Rock had thought of that riposte...bet Ricky Gervais would have! What? Ah come on, it's just a joke, guys, - what're you gonna do, slap me for it? Oh...

    I had an interesting debate about this with my girlfriend last night. If all these secret details of their life came out via hacking or paparazzi snooping or whatever, I'd take pity on them and feel bad for their situation. But you really don't get to say something like that when you go on your own podcast or take every opportunity to share the most intimate, sordid, personal details of your life with the world. It's one or the other.

    I guess it's all a bit moot though when the joke had absolutely nothing to do with such private details and is merely a hair loss joke (something that Will not only laughed at but is something that Jada has been on record about, in terms of not caring/accepting it/not being bothered by comments/etc.)
  • Posts: 328
    Venutius wrote: »
    As for 'keep my wife's name out of your mouth' - bit rich considering she's spent years telling the media about all the other people who've put things in her mouth while she's been married to Will. If only Chris Rock had thought of that riposte...bet Ricky Gervais would have! What? Ah come on, it's just a joke, guys, - what're you gonna do, slap me for it? Oh...

    Oh Chris would have gone there but if you watch closely he holds himself back after Will tells him for the second time to keep his wife's name out of his mouth. As for if it was Gervais, if Smith did hit him, which I doubt, Gervais would have really gone in with the jokes.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,000
    mtm wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »

    Alopecia isn't a 'hairstyle' though.

    Which Chris may or may not have been aware of. The TMZ headline says he wasn't, and I don't think most people were, but who knows.

    It seems to be very well-publicised in all of those circles so I find the idea he didn't to be pretty suspect. He's supposed to have done his research on all of these people, and I would imagine he probably knows most of them.
    And honestly: if I see a woman with a shaved head my first thought can be 'oh gosh, I hope she hasn't been ill' as it can often be a sign of something much worse. If I don't know I don't make a joke about it, so I'd be surprised if he decided to wade in with no info at all and he would seem even more at fault if he did.
    I too have lost true choice when it comes to hairstyles ;-) so I will confess I don't feel all that precious about it.

    Well, I don't think that's how it works for alopecia, especially for women where hair loss is much more uncommon and upsetting. It's a dick move to make a joke about it, it's an overreaction to give him a slap; but it was deserving of a reaction in some way.
    Personally I think people are way overreacting about a slap and the whole thing is more funny than any sort of sign of a terrible decline in society.

    Just because something is well publicized doesn’t mean everyone has come across it. I didn’t even know of her hair issue until that night.
  • ProfJoeButcherProfJoeButcher Bless your heart
    Posts: 1,664
    mtm wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »

    Alopecia isn't a 'hairstyle' though.

    Which Chris may or may not have been aware of. The TMZ headline says he wasn't, and I don't think most people were, but who knows.

    It seems to be very well-publicised in all of those circles so I find the idea he didn't to be pretty suspect. He's supposed to have done his research on all of these people, and I would imagine he probably knows most of them.
    And honestly: if I see a woman with a shaved head my first thought can be 'oh gosh, I hope she hasn't been ill' as it can often be a sign of something much worse. If I don't know I don't make a joke about it, so I'd be surprised if he decided to wade in with no info at all and he would seem even more at fault if he did.
    I too have lost true choice when it comes to hairstyles ;-) so I will confess I don't feel all that precious about it.

    Well, I don't think that's how it works for alopecia, especially for women where hair loss is much more uncommon and upsetting. It's a dick move to make a joke about it, it's an overreaction to give him a slap; but it was deserving of a reaction in some way.
    Personally I think people are way overreacting about a slap and the whole thing is more funny than any sort of sign of a terrible decline in society.

    Just because something is well publicized doesn’t mean everyone has come across it. I didn’t even know of her hair issue until that night.

    Not only that, but if he had come across it, as mentioned by Creasy47, he'd have come across a woman who has extensively documented her "struggle" in public and "has to laugh about it".

    And it's hair loss.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,449
    One thing I've learned is that Rock would be a terrible roaster. Someone should've called Jeff Ross for that part of the night's entertainment.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,000
    mtm wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »

    Alopecia isn't a 'hairstyle' though.

    Which Chris may or may not have been aware of. The TMZ headline says he wasn't, and I don't think most people were, but who knows.

    It seems to be very well-publicised in all of those circles so I find the idea he didn't to be pretty suspect. He's supposed to have done his research on all of these people, and I would imagine he probably knows most of them.
    And honestly: if I see a woman with a shaved head my first thought can be 'oh gosh, I hope she hasn't been ill' as it can often be a sign of something much worse. If I don't know I don't make a joke about it, so I'd be surprised if he decided to wade in with no info at all and he would seem even more at fault if he did.
    I too have lost true choice when it comes to hairstyles ;-) so I will confess I don't feel all that precious about it.

    Well, I don't think that's how it works for alopecia, especially for women where hair loss is much more uncommon and upsetting. It's a dick move to make a joke about it, it's an overreaction to give him a slap; but it was deserving of a reaction in some way.
    Personally I think people are way overreacting about a slap and the whole thing is more funny than any sort of sign of a terrible decline in society.

    Just because something is well publicized doesn’t mean everyone has come across it. I didn’t even know of her hair issue until that night.

    Not only that, but if he had come across it, as mentioned by Creasy47, he'd have come across a woman who has extensively documented her "struggle" in public and "has to laugh about it".

    And it's hair loss.

    It makes me admire celebrities like Sean Connery who had zero sensitivity over his hair loss. Tom Mankiewicz relayed a story about how around of the time if DAF production he and Connery were at some event among the audience. When Connery was called to the stage, he took off that toupee he wore for DAF and walked up to the stage.

    As someone who’s recently started the process of hair loss, I find that immensely refreshing and encouraging, especially given how Hollywood usually forces their stars to wear toupees to keep up a certain image. Connery didn’t give a toss. He wasn’t against it depending on a role like Bond, but he made no fuss either way.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited March 2022 Posts: 14,861
    mtm wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »

    Alopecia isn't a 'hairstyle' though.

    Which Chris may or may not have been aware of. The TMZ headline says he wasn't, and I don't think most people were, but who knows.

    It seems to be very well-publicised in all of those circles so I find the idea he didn't to be pretty suspect. He's supposed to have done his research on all of these people, and I would imagine he probably knows most of them.
    And honestly: if I see a woman with a shaved head my first thought can be 'oh gosh, I hope she hasn't been ill' as it can often be a sign of something much worse. If I don't know I don't make a joke about it, so I'd be surprised if he decided to wade in with no info at all and he would seem even more at fault if he did.
    I too have lost true choice when it comes to hairstyles ;-) so I will confess I don't feel all that precious about it.

    Well, I don't think that's how it works for alopecia, especially for women where hair loss is much more uncommon and upsetting. It's a dick move to make a joke about it, it's an overreaction to give him a slap; but it was deserving of a reaction in some way.
    Personally I think people are way overreacting about a slap and the whole thing is more funny than any sort of sign of a terrible decline in society.

    Just because something is well publicized doesn’t mean everyone has come across it. I didn’t even know of her hair issue until that night.

    As I said, me neither, but I'm not the guy researching all the stars to write jokes about them. I'm going to bet that Rock probably knew more of the films up for nomination than I did too.
    mtm wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »

    Alopecia isn't a 'hairstyle' though.

    Which Chris may or may not have been aware of. The TMZ headline says he wasn't, and I don't think most people were, but who knows.

    It seems to be very well-publicised in all of those circles so I find the idea he didn't to be pretty suspect. He's supposed to have done his research on all of these people, and I would imagine he probably knows most of them.
    And honestly: if I see a woman with a shaved head my first thought can be 'oh gosh, I hope she hasn't been ill' as it can often be a sign of something much worse. If I don't know I don't make a joke about it, so I'd be surprised if he decided to wade in with no info at all and he would seem even more at fault if he did.
    I too have lost true choice when it comes to hairstyles ;-) so I will confess I don't feel all that precious about it.

    Well, I don't think that's how it works for alopecia, especially for women where hair loss is much more uncommon and upsetting. It's a dick move to make a joke about it, it's an overreaction to give him a slap; but it was deserving of a reaction in some way.
    Personally I think people are way overreacting about a slap and the whole thing is more funny than any sort of sign of a terrible decline in society.

    Just because something is well publicized doesn’t mean everyone has come across it. I didn’t even know of her hair issue until that night.

    Not only that, but if he had come across it, as mentioned by Creasy47, he'd have come across a woman who has extensively documented her "struggle" in public and "has to laugh about it".

    And it's hair loss.

    But if he actually didn't know about it, he may well have been laughing about a woman with cancer. I'm going to bet he didn't take that risk.
    Looking at her face, I don't think she found it funny.

    I don't really get why people are defending the joke. I think comedians should feel they can joke about anything, but that doesn't automatically mean that everyone should think all jokes are great just because they're free to do it.
    It's wrong not to laugh at a woman suffering hair loss due to an illness apparently, and then simultaneously apparently anyone finding the whole thing rather funny is also wrong: so are we supposed to have senses of humour or not? I think it's a dud joke which was made more entertaining. There have certainly been many memes about it which I've found much funnier than Rock's gag :)

    DarthDimi wrote: »
    One thing I've learned is that Rock would be a terrible roaster. Someone should've called Jeff Ross for that part of the night's entertainment.

    Yes indeed, it's a skill he doesn't seem to have.
  • ProfJoeButcherProfJoeButcher Bless your heart
    edited March 2022 Posts: 1,664
    mtm wrote: »

    It's wrong not to laugh at a woman suffering hair loss due to an illness apparently, and then simultaneously you're saying that anyone finding the whole thing rather funny is also wrong: so are we supposed to have senses of humour or not?

    Well, I would say we should have a sense of humor about jokes, but not about violence. But I come from an apparently brief window in history where that was a common belief!

    Incidentally, my quote about how Jada "has to laugh about it" is her talking about it in her extensive documentation of it, a bit before proudly showing her shaved head.
    mtm wrote: »
    It's wrong not to laugh at a woman suffering hair loss due to an illness apparently

    Well, nobody has said this. People have suggested it's not wrong to say that one attractive woman with a shaved head looks like another attractive woman with a shaved head. But nobody I've seen has said it's wrong not to laugh.

    And "hair loss due to an illness" is pretty much a tautology. The illness causes nothing but hair loss.
    mtm wrote: »
    Yes indeed, it's a skill he doesn't seem to have

    I don't see why people think this was an attempted roast. He made a joke a few years ago about her that was more in that vein, and it was quite good.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited March 2022 Posts: 14,861
    mtm wrote: »

    It's wrong not to laugh at a woman suffering hair loss due to an illness apparently, and then simultaneously you're saying that anyone finding the whole thing rather funny is also wrong: so are we supposed to have senses of humour or not?

    Well, I would say we should have a sense of humor about jokes, but not about violence. But I come from an apparently brief window in history where that was a common belief!

    I would say check out the memes, they're pretty funny.
    To me, some guy giving another guy a light slap because he insulted his missus is pretty much the oldest thing going (not that I've ever done it myself). I would imagine comedians in various clubs about 50 years ago saw it as an occupational hazard :)
    Incidentally, my quote about how Jada "has to laugh about it" is her talking about it in her extensive documentation of it, a bit before proudly showing her shaved head.
    mtm wrote: »
    It's wrong not to laugh at a woman suffering hair loss due to an illness apparently

    Well, nobody has said this. People have suggested it's not wrong to say that one attractive woman with a shaved head looks like another attractive woman with a shaved head. But nobody I've seen has said it's wrong not to laugh.

    It wasn't meant as a complement, come on. And you've said it's a "fashion category you can make fun of" etc.
    It's a crappy, mean joke that a guy overreacted to. I think both of them messed up.
    And "hair loss due to an illness" is pretty much a tautology. The illness causes nothing but hair loss.

    Let's not pick on grammar, it's a messageboard. I'll probably make a spelling error too, soon.
  • ProfJoeButcherProfJoeButcher Bless your heart
    Posts: 1,664
    Well, no, there's a purpose to it. "Illness that causes hair loss" sounds worse than "hair loss".

    And of course it wasn't a compliment. But what's the joke? He's saying she looks like Demi Moore in GI Jane. Because they both have shaved heads. That's it. Does Jada not know her head is shaved? There are multiple Instagram videos about it she could watch!
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,372
    Well, no, there's a purpose to it. "Illness that causes hair loss" sounds worse than "hair loss".

    And of course it wasn't a compliment. But what's the joke? He's saying she looks like Demi Moore in GI Jane. Because they both have shaved heads. That's it. Does Jada not know her head is shaved? There are multiple Instagram videos about it she could watch!

    Not only that, but again, Will clearly found the joke funny and Jada herself has professed that she doesn't at all care what people think. So how'd these thoughts and actions translate to violence in just a few seconds? Bizarre.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited March 2022 Posts: 14,861
    Well, no, there's a purpose to it. "Illness that causes hair loss" sounds worse than "hair loss".

    That doesn't mean she should be fine about it, it's up to her.
    Tell these guys that it's not that bad:
    https://www.alopecia.org.uk/blog/responding-to-the-events-from-the-2022-oscars
    And of course it wasn't a compliment. But what's the joke? He's saying she looks like Demi Moore in GI Jane. Because they both have shaved heads. That's it. Does Jada not know her head is shaved? There are multiple Instagram videos about it she could watch!

    It's shaved because of a medical condition which is often upsetting for people; that would be why she's using her fame to try and normalise it on Instagram etc.

    I'm not sure why we're getting into the idea that the condition is nothing anyone should be upset about and should just take jokes at their own expense, and should never talk about and just keep quiet. Of everyone involved, Ms Pinkett Smith really is the one who did nothing wrong.

    Right, I'm sure folks are getting very bored of reading this so I'll leave it there. Thanks for the interesting chat, Prof Joe.
  • ProfJoeButcherProfJoeButcher Bless your heart
    Posts: 1,664
    If the good folks at alopecia.org come in here and downplay violence, mischaracterize what people are saying, and make other dopey remarks, I'll be happy to engage!
  • Posts: 328
    It's a bloody joke about hair. It's not serious at all. Every joke ever told has offended at least one person. The reality is, Rock was assaulted because of Smith's own insecurities derived from his marital issues and tried to be the big man. He disgraced himself but whatever, I just hope this doesn't facilitate a new precedent for comedic performers to now be physically attacked.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,895
    Jerry Sadowitz must wonder what all the fuss is about...
  • Posts: 1,693
    Gotta tell you I am more outraged that Lazenby was not mentioned in the intro to the Bond presentation then this stuff with Smith.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,449
    delfloria wrote: »
    Gotta tell you I am more outraged that Lazenby was not mentioned in the intro to the Bond presentation then this stuff with Smith.

    George is often forgotten. It's an outrage indeed.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,372
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    delfloria wrote: »
    Gotta tell you I am more outraged that Lazenby was not mentioned in the intro to the Bond presentation then this stuff with Smith.

    George is often forgotten. It's an outrage indeed.

    It always is and always will be an outrage.
  • ProfJoeButcherProfJoeButcher Bless your heart
    Posts: 1,664
    It's surprising too, because even among non-geeks, OHMSS has finally come to be recognized as one of the greats.
  • Posts: 12,837
    mtm wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Will showed his worst personality to the whole world. He laughed at first. If he were truly upset (I think he did not fake that) there were other options, of course. Physical assault and battery is NOT okay, or should be shrugged away. The lighter takes on this, and worse (some on social media totally cheering him on) are truly sickening. Especially those takes of "at least he didn't hit a woman." WTH. Come on, people.

    Like I said, in an alternate universe he kept his cool, let it pass, and allowed the world to judge Rock, not him. But, I must admit that I'm not so sure I wouldn't have lashed out at Rock myself. Not if someone had said something about me--I can take it. But if my wife suffered from an awful condition and a third-rate comedian goes that low on stage, her pained response might kick me into action too. I'm not sure, though. I'd probably be too much of a coward to do it there and then. But I'm not willing to go so far as to throw stones at Smith because I'm not sure how I would have responded. I know it's not the right thing to do but we're an impulsive, emotional species sometimes. Plus, I cannot begin to fathom the amount of stress he must have been under. That doesn't condone anything, but it might explain something.

    Evidently, I'm never going to approve of violence, even knowing that in the weakest or angriest of moments I'm probably capable of it too, and I'm neither proud nor happy about that.

    Yep, neither of them exactly covered themselves in glory, but I do think it's understandable if not excusable, and: I tend to think it's really not that big a deal. Folks are reacting as if he murdered Rock with all of this 'violence must never be condoned' stuff but it was a bit of a slap around the chops, you'll see much worse in Cardiff city centre on a Saturday night and over much the same sort of thing.

    Mate if it wasn’t for our drastically different opinions on Mission Impossible then I’d genuinely be wondering if you were my long lost clone at times, completely agree. This gave me a laugh earlier

    https://amp.theguardian.com/media/commentisfree/2022/mar/29/will-smiths-oscars-slap-created-a-storm-of-increasingly-irrelevant-internet-hot-takes
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,053
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    delfloria wrote: »
    Gotta tell you I am more outraged that Lazenby was not mentioned in the intro to the Bond presentation then this stuff with Smith.

    George is often forgotten. It's an outrage indeed.

    It always is and always will be an outrage.

    Timothy Dalton should have presented because he help start darker, but human hero characters in modern blockbuster movies. He (like Michael Keaton as Batman) let cinema know it was time to change. An actor too respect, plus he does comedy well (Mr. Pricklepants). He and Lazenby should have presented then the people they got, as they had nothing to do with James Bond.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,053
    It's surprising too, because even among non-geeks, OHMSS has finally come to be recognized as one of the greats.

    I’m happy for that because OHMSS proves that an art house style can work for a blockbuster adventure movie. The one other time that this style full-on worked for Bond was Skyfall.
  • Junglist_1985Junglist_1985 Los Angeles
    Posts: 1,006
    Very pleased with the generous clips of QOS during the 60th Anniversary montage. And the icing on the cake was “I never left”.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    edited March 2022 Posts: 4,247
    If only Lazenby had done at least another Bond film. He's the only Bond people keep discovering every single day, because I've met casual Bond fans and friends here who look at him and say they never knew he was before Moore.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,372
    Very pleased with the generous clips of QOS during the 60th Anniversary montage. And the icing on the cake was “I never left”.

    This is always appreciated too. I've seen some Craig retrospective videos that omit QoS almost entirely.
  • Posts: 1,394
    Jimjambond wrote: »
    It's a bloody joke about hair. It's not serious at all. Every joke ever told has offended at least one person. The reality is, Rock was assaulted because of Smith's own insecurities derived from his marital issues and tried to be the big man. He disgraced himself but whatever, I just hope this doesn't facilitate a new precedent for comedic performers to now be physically attacked.

    Agreed.I don’t see what was so offensive.Rock was comparing Jada to a strong independent woman like G.I Jane.If anything,the joke seemed well intentioned and very light.He even said “ Jada,love ya “.

    And as many have said,Will found it funny at first,just because the woman who has regularly humiliated him in public gave him a bad look was no excuse to do what he did.

    And it’s so ironic that he seems ok with other guys drilling his wife,but not one comedian making a joke about her shaved head.

  • edited March 2022 Posts: 6,682
    But what's the joke? He's saying she looks like Demi Moore in GI Jane. Because they both have shaved heads. That's it.

    That's what I gathered from it. The joke didn't appear to be about hair loss, but about a harmless comparison with a film character.

    Now, I'm not Chris Rock, so I don't know if he knew about her hair loss, but it's certainly plausible that he didn't. I think that makes a big difference. Also, the people at the Oscars tend to sport extravagant looks and clothes, so one wouldn't necessarily associate Jada Pinkett-Smith's short hair with hair loss.

    At any rate, I don't think that choosing to deliver that particular joke required a prior investigation on the woman. At most, if she found the joke annoying because it's a sensitive issue for her, Rock could have said he was sorry to bother her.

    If Will Smith wasn't sure of malicious intent, I think he should have let the moment pass and address the issue with Rock at a later point. And if he was sure it was a mean-spirited comment, he should have done the same. Reacting the way he did cast a bad light on him and detracted and distracted from the purpose of the ceremony, even from the award he himself got. Also, him hitting Rock seemed disproportionate.

    DarthDimi wrote: »
    But I'm not willing to go so far as to throw stones at Smith because I'm not sure how I would have responded.

    Yes, all things considered, it's fair to keep this in mind.

    ---

    That Bond montage at the Oscars was fantastic. I loved how they showed a gunbarrel sequence for each actor. And Lazenby got decent screentime.
  • ContrabandContraband Sweden
    Posts: 3,018
    I'm posting it in here.

    In celebration of the 60th anniversary of the James Bond film franchise, a Land Rover Defender 90 with a unique 007 livery made a winning one-off appearance in the Defender Bowler Challenge in Dolgellau, Wales, driven by Bond stunt driver and rally champion Mark Higgins.



    https://www.007.com/007-land-rover-wins-rally/
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,861
    Thanks; shame there isn't a bit more footage of it actually rallying.
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