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Mission: Impossible - films and tv series

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  • boldfingerboldfinger
    edited August 2018 Posts: 5,767
    bondjames wrote: »
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Watched Fallout today. Perhaps I was in the wrong theater, but I wasn´t overwhelmed.
    Not a bad film by any means. But.
    The music sucked most of the time.
    Cruise can do all the stunts in the world, but there wasn´t one single shot in Fallout that came even remotely close to the action in Ronin or Michael Mann stuff. For me it became absolutely clear today that great-looking action cinema has to do a lot more with capturing magic than with the actor doing his own stunts. Give me iconic shots!
    Overall, I wasn´t fond of the cinematography. Too many dark shots, which seems to connect again to misguided striving for realism.
    I didn´t enjoy the scarcity of humor, although it was very good when it was there.
    Wasn´t the right day perhaps, but I don´t feel like re-watching it anytime soon.
    @boldfinger, let me guess, you're not a fan of TDK, Nolan or Zimmer, am I right?

    I think Cruise channeled all of that in Fallout (but in an MI context), so I can appreciate how it may not work for some.

    Definitely a bit different from the prior two entries which were much lighter and not as emotional. I think McQuarrie nicely straddled the line between action, emotional depth and humour without tipping too far into the heaviness that was MI:3, but it certainly lacks the lightness of GP/RN.
    @bondjames, you guessed absolutely right ;-). While in RN the inspiration by a number of Bond film scenes was obvious but clever, this time I found it too immense and annoying, and you´re absolutely right, beside Bond film scenes TDK shone through quite obviously. Which I find quite shocking, because TDK is such an old hat by now, and SF already was heavily influenced by it.

    I don´t want to go too deep into the M:I vs. Bond debate, because basically I´m among those who feel enriched by having both, but I couldn´t help thinking that as long as M:I keeps on ripping stuff off so obviously and so massively, and as long as they don´t shoot those amazing action pieces appropriately, the franchise is only a competition for Bond while the latter keeps on mucking it up as recently.

    One other thought that occured to me while watching the film:
    The guy near the beginning of the film trying to sell the plutonium to Hunt says that everytime he sees Hunt he feels nothing. I tried throughout the film to find out what I feel for Hunt, and I had to agree with that guy. I deeply respect Cruise for his tremendous work, but especially in this film I found his character rather empty, despite all what happens, and even despite the empotions he´s going through for instance when he sits in the truck with Walker before the extraction of Lane.

    Oh, and one other Thing:
    During the helicopter chase, most of the shots could as well be done by SFX in my eyes, there were only a few shots that really gave me the impression that Cruise is actually flying the thing himself. The shots with Cavill look more convincing for some reason. Perhaps it was because my expectations were led in a wrong direction by all the hype about Cruise learning to fly a helicopter, but that´s what you get when you build such hype. I find it similar to the opening car chase from QoS. By itself, the helicopter chase in Fallout is probably very cool stuff, but if I constantly keep thinking, aha, he flew that helicopter himself for real, I drift in the wrong direction.
    And anyhow, of what use is it that Cruise flies the helicopter himself when the final crash looks totally CGI?
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,087
    I can see mission impossible 8 Cruise is happily the leader like Phelps, and to thirds of the film his team does all the work, and then one of his team is injured, and there is no one who can replace him, so Ethan must throw himself back into action for one showstopping stunt that saves the day. That way they limit the amount of stress they are putting on cruise aging body, but still get to milk the marketing over an impression stunt, and Ethan is still part of the team and a big presence in the film. I think this films are just getting more popular, so Paramount will probably green light another one soon.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    ...or perhaps by Mission: Impossible 10, Hunt decides he's had enough, turns against the whole team for his own benefit and ends up getting killed by some newcomer IMF agent in the end, who takes the team leadership over. ;)
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited August 2018 Posts: 8,087
    Strange to think that Cruise is the same age now than Jon Voight was in the first movie. How time flies.

    Correction the same age.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    56 is the new 42, these days. ;)
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited August 2018 Posts: 8,087
    For me, Since 2011 Mission Impossible has become what James Bond was and I think still wants to be, but can't get back to: A really fantastic, thrilling, fun blockbuster spy franchise. I say this because to me Bond has lacked those common hallmarks of the genre and has instead adopted the trappings of a character drama. When I hear that Mission Impossible theme, I know I am in for a rip-roaring ride with many twists and turns, but most of all, I will get to feel like a Spy in this heighten world. It's cool. When I hear the Bond theme at the start of SP, for instance, it no longer fits with the film it precedes. The Bond theme is designed to portray the mood of spying and thrilling excitement, but I don't get any of that from the film that's presented. I don't feel like I'm in for a seat of the pants experience, or that I will be a part of a world of espionage with all its coolness and mystique. With SF and SP, I feel like I am watching a character drama, about a guy who happens to be a spy. When the mission impossible team rock up in the Burj Building in their suits, all swaggered up, I'm like "yeah! Let's get our spy on." It's ultra-cool. When we cut to macau in Skyfall, and Bond's stood with a towel round his waist, I don't get a sense of a spy setting out on a mission, just a guy in his hotel room. And the ending at the Skyfall mansion I don't feel is typical spying, or even action, it's just about those characters surviving that encountre. This might sound ok, but I keep thinking about that Bond theme, and everything it implies. Danger, thrills, excitement, coolness etc. It just doesn't ring true with what is on screen, sadly. Whereas the Mission Impossible team you know you are going to get all of that, and feel a part of it, with Bond at the moment, not only do I not feel a part of it, but Bond doesn't feel a part of it.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    boldfinger wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Watched Fallout today. Perhaps I was in the wrong theater, but I wasn´t overwhelmed.
    Not a bad film by any means. But.
    The music sucked most of the time.
    Cruise can do all the stunts in the world, but there wasn´t one single shot in Fallout that came even remotely close to the action in Ronin or Michael Mann stuff. For me it became absolutely clear today that great-looking action cinema has to do a lot more with capturing magic than with the actor doing his own stunts. Give me iconic shots!
    Overall, I wasn´t fond of the cinematography. Too many dark shots, which seems to connect again to misguided striving for realism.
    I didn´t enjoy the scarcity of humor, although it was very good when it was there.
    Wasn´t the right day perhaps, but I don´t feel like re-watching it anytime soon.
    @boldfinger, let me guess, you're not a fan of TDK, Nolan or Zimmer, am I right?

    I think Cruise channeled all of that in Fallout (but in an MI context), so I can appreciate how it may not work for some.

    Definitely a bit different from the prior two entries which were much lighter and not as emotional. I think McQuarrie nicely straddled the line between action, emotional depth and humour without tipping too far into the heaviness that was MI:3, but it certainly lacks the lightness of GP/RN.
    @bondjames, you guessed absolutely right ;-). While in RN the inspiration by a number of Bond film scenes was obvious but clever, this time I found it too immense and annoying, and you´re absolutely right, beside Bond film scenes TDK shone through quite obviously. Which I find quite shocking, because TDK is such an old hat by now, and SF already was heavily influenced by it.

    I don´t want to go too deep into the M:I vs. Bond debate, because basically I´m among those who feel enriched by having both, but I couldn´t help thinking that as long as M:I keeps on ripping stuff off so obviously and so massively, and as long as they don´t shoot those amazing action pieces appropriately, the franchise is only a competition for Bond while the latter keeps on mucking it up as recently.
    Haha @boldfinger, I confess that I actually knew about your aversion to all things Nolan and Zimmer. I just wanted you to acknowledge that this may have possibly impacted your impressions of MI:6.

    Cruise and McQuarrie definitely tipped their hat to Nolan (as I said before, I even felt Wally Pfister's influence on the Parisian cinematography, which is no bad thing in my book). I get your point on the helicopter scenes. I loved it, but not because it was Cruise up there. Rather, it was on account of the tension & pacing inherent in the chase. The money shot for me was
    the shot of Cavill inside his copter from the front, with Cruises' machine in the background. Lovely stuff

    Your comments made me think of something though. When Cruise was making this film there were rumours swirling about Nolan being under consideration for B25.

    We know Cruise is a competitive sort, and he probably figured that Nolan may get a crack at it eventually if not next time out. Why not try to make a Nolan style MI film to show them how it's done? Just a thought.

    I personally am happy that he took this approach, particularly for the 10th anniversary. The summer of 2008 was The Summer of the Bat, and its influence has been far reaching and long lasting.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    For me, Since 2011 Mission Impossible has become what James Bond was and I think still wants to be, but can't get back to: A really fantastic, thrilling, fun blockbuster spy franchise. I say this because to me Bond has lacked those common hallmarks of the genre and has instead adopted the trappings of a character drama. When I hear that Mission Impossible theme, I know I am in for a rip-roaring ride with many twists and turns, but most of all, I will get to feel like a Spy in this heighten world. It's cool. When I hear the Bond theme at the start of SP, for instance, it no longer fits with the film it precedes. The Bond theme is designed to portray the mood of spying and thrilling excitement, but I don't get any of that from the film that's presented. I don't feel like I'm in for a seat of the pants experience, or that I will be a part of a world of espionage with all its coolness and mystique. With SF and SP, I feel like I am watching a character drama, about a guy who happens to be a spy. When the mission impossible team rock up in the Burj Building in their suits, all swaggered up, I'm like "yeah! Let's get our spy on." It's ultra-cool. When we cut to macau in Skyfall, and Bond's stood with a towel round his waist, I don't get a sense of a spy setting out on a mission, just a guy in his hotel room. And the ending at the Skyfall mansion I don't feel is typical spying, or even action, it's just about those characters surviving that encountre. This might sound ok, but I keep thinking about that Bond theme, and everything it implies. Danger, thrills, excitement, coolness etc. It just doesn't ring true with what is on screen, sadly. Whereas the Mission Impossible team you know you are going to get all of that, and feel a part of it, with Bond at the moment, not only do I not feel a part of it, but Bond doesn't feel a part of it.

    Why is your username @Mendes4Lyfe?
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,415
    Are we to assume?
    That the White Widow is Max the Arms Dealers Daughter?
  • AlexanderWaverlyAlexanderWaverly
    Posts: 2,115
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Are we to assume?
    That the White Widow is Max the Arms Dealers Daughter?

    Answer:
    Yes. Though I missed that when I saw it.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,468
    Christopher McQuarrie's thoughts on returning for another one (apparently Cruise and the studio have asked him to do so):

    http://collider.com/mission-impossible-7-christopher-mcquarrie/#images
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,415
    Good luck getting Sean Harris to return as I heard he isn't keen on sequels and had a difficult time returning for Fallout.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    AlexanderWaverly wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Are we to assume?
    That the White Widow is Max the Arms Dealers Daughter?

    Answer:
    Yes. Though I missed that when I saw it.

    That weirded me out a bit. I guess it was a nice reference for the fans but it seemed a bit pointless, they didn't really do anything with it.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,468
    @Last_Rat_Standing, agreed. I'm hoping he's sidelined for good now; breaking him out once again would be a bit tired of an idea at this point.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,415
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Last_Rat_Standing, agreed. I'm hoping he's sidelined for good now; breaking him out once again would be a bit tired of an idea at this point.

    Yeah but where else would you go? They've done Rogue Organizations, Arms Dealers (twice) one Rogue Agent and I guess an extremist in regards to Ghost Protocol.

    In terms of villainy, it's been done in all areas.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited August 2018 Posts: 15,690
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Last_Rat_Standing, agreed. I'm hoping he's sidelined for good now; breaking him out once again would be a bit tired of an idea at this point.

    Yeah but where else would you go? They've done Rogue Organizations, Arms Dealers (twice) one Rogue Agent and I guess an extremist in regards to Ghost Protocol.

    In terms of villainy, it's been done in all areas.

    Get Keanu Reeves to play the villain for the 7th film. If there is one way they can top the action in Fallout, it's to have Cruise and Keanu Reeves, arguably the most impressive action stars in Hollywood right now, going against each other.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,468
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Last_Rat_Standing, agreed. I'm hoping he's sidelined for good now; breaking him out once again would be a bit tired of an idea at this point.

    Yeah but where else would you go? They've done Rogue Organizations, Arms Dealers (twice) one Rogue Agent and I guess an extremist in regards to Ghost Protocol.

    In terms of villainy, it's been done in all areas.

    Who knows, though I doubt that'll stop them from making another one.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,415
    Jim Phelps foster son who in the last 22 years was the mastermind behind it all.

    It was me Ethan, the author of why you almost drowned and had to scale the Burj Kalifa
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited August 2018 Posts: 15,690
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Jim Phelps foster son who in the last 22 years was the mastermind behind it all.

    It was me Ethan, the author of why you almost drowned and had to scale the Burj Kalifa

    Why not make it exactly like SP - have Ethan Hunt's long lost brother being the mastermind of all the events in the 6 previous M:I films? I was thinking Tom Cruise/Ethan Hunt's brother Raymond played by Dustin Hoffman in Rain Man.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,415
    DaltonCraig007 wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Jim Phelps foster son who in the last 22 years was the mastermind behind it all.

    It was me Ethan, the author of why you almost drowned and had to scale the Burj Kalifa

    Why not make it exactly like SP - have Ethan Hunt's long lost brother being the mastermind of all the events in the 6 previous M:I films? I was thinking Tom Cruise/Ethan Hunt's brother Raymond played by Dustin Hoffman in Rain Man.

    Uh oh. 27 minutes until bomb.
  • boldfingerboldfinger
    edited August 2018 Posts: 5,767
    bondjames wrote: »
    Haha @boldfinger, I confess that I actually knew about your aversion to all things Nolan and Zimmer. I just wanted you to acknowledge that this may have possibly impacted your impressions of MI:6.
    You surely put the finger in the right direction, @bondjames. It´s a bit of a worst case scenario for me: Not only am I not the biggest fan of Nolan (I wouldn´t say I loath him, but I find him much too overrated), but I also find the way he and especially one of his films is emulated in M:I 6 too blatant. I don´t like being so negative, especially after I really enjoyed M:I 4&5 a lot, but here we are ;-).


    DaltonCraig007 wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Last_Rat_Standing, agreed. I'm hoping he's sidelined for good now; breaking him out once again would be a bit tired of an idea at this point.

    Yeah but where else would you go? They've done Rogue Organizations, Arms Dealers (twice) one Rogue Agent and I guess an extremist in regards to Ghost Protocol.

    In terms of villainy, it's been done in all areas.

    Get Keanu Reeves to play the villain for the 7th film. If there is one way they can top the action in Fallout, it's to have Cruise and Keanu Reeves, arguably the most impressive action stars in Hollywood right now, going against each other.
    Only if they add Denzel Washington as Luther´s gun-crazy just-out-of-jail brother Martin ;-).
  • vzokvzok
    Posts: 4,024
    DaltonCraig007 wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Jim Phelps foster son who in the last 22 years was the mastermind behind it all.

    It was me Ethan, the author of why you almost drowned and had to scale the Burj Kalifa

    Why not make it exactly like SP - have Ethan Hunt's long lost brother being the mastermind of all the events in the 6 previous M:I films? I was thinking Tom Cruise/Ethan Hunt's brother Raymond played by Dustin Hoffman in Rain Man.

    There’ll be some great chases as he is an excellent driver.
  • M_BlaiseM_Blaise
    Posts: 332
    Saw it today, very good film. Pushes it a bit too much with the twists in one scene and with cliffhangers. Walker was a mostly useless character with no real personality.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    boldfinger wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    Haha @boldfinger, I confess that I actually knew about your aversion to all things Nolan and Zimmer. I just wanted you to acknowledge that this may have possibly impacted your impressions of MI:6.
    You surely put the finger in the right direction, @bondjames. It´s a bit of a worst case scenario for me: Not only am I not the biggest fan of Nolan (I wouldn´t say I loath him, but I find him much too overrated), but I also find the way he and especially one of his films is emulated in M:I 6 too blatant. I don´t like being so negative, especially after I really enjoyed M:I 4&5 a lot, but here we are ;-).
    I'm sorry it wasn't entirely to your liking @boldfinger, especially since I know you were a big fan of GP/RN.

    I hope it improves for you on a 2nd viewing at least. As I mentioned previously, I had the benefit of not being spoiled by trailers and what not prior to seeing it, and I'm sure that helped me to enjoy the spectacle to its fullest.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,468
    @bondjames, glad to see you're still sticking with that going in cold mentality, it really does help.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I'm certainly trying @Creasy47. Let's see how long it lasts. I forgot to mention that for some reason I missed most, if not all, of the trailers for MI:RN as well (not deliberately - it just happened that way), and that film remains one of my utmost favourites in this genre. So perhaps that was inspiration for me to do the same with Fallout, and again the results have been favourable to me.

    The last one which seems to have been spoiled for me is Venom. It appears as though the 2nd trailer pretty much gives the entire film away.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,468
    I started doing it (albeit not for all films, sadly - sometimes I don't have the willpower) around the time The Force Awakens came out, and it's been a success since.

    That's another issue with trailers - past over-watching them and spoiling yourself, you're bound to inevitably come across one that spoils the whole movie in two minutes.
  • boldfingerboldfinger
    edited August 2018 Posts: 5,767
    bondjames wrote: »
    boldfinger wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    Haha @boldfinger, I confess that I actually knew about your aversion to all things Nolan and Zimmer. I just wanted you to acknowledge that this may have possibly impacted your impressions of MI:6.
    You surely put the finger in the right direction, @bondjames. It´s a bit of a worst case scenario for me: Not only am I not the biggest fan of Nolan (I wouldn´t say I loath him, but I find him much too overrated), but I also find the way he and especially one of his films is emulated in M:I 6 too blatant. I don´t like being so negative, especially after I really enjoyed M:I 4&5 a lot, but here we are ;-).
    I'm sorry it wasn't entirely to your liking @boldfinger, especially since I know you were a big fan of GP/RN.

    I hope it improves for you on a 2nd viewing at least. As I mentioned previously, I had the benefit of not being spoiled by trailers and what not prior to seeing it, and I'm sure that helped me to enjoy the spectacle to its fullest.
    Thanks, @bondjames. It would be cool if the wish to watch it again would grow in me.
    I don´t find that trailers spoil much for me. I anyhow like to sink into a movie through watching it over and over again, and I don´t give that much importance to that first impact a film has on me. It seems to me right now that internet stories have a much more misleading effect on me. So the really hard question is, how can I avoid those? That´s going to be a tough challenge ;-).

  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,690
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,690
    Tom Cruise is now 3 years older than Richard Wilson was when he first portrayed Victor Meldrew in the sitcom One Foot in the Grave:

    Victor_Meldrew.png
    000_1805xr.jpg
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