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And the Klebbie for worst/most illogical gadget used by James Bond....page 140

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  • jobojobo
    edited June 2020 Posts: 7,506
    I do feel like the most Flemingesque of these would be Sanchez
  • R1s1ngs0nR1s1ngs0n France
    Posts: 2,033
    Sanchez
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,455
    Sanchez.

    However the rest are top tier for me minus Stromberg.
  • OctopussyOctopussy Piz Gloria, Schilthorn, Switzerland.
    edited June 2020 Posts: 1,081
    Hard choice between Alec Trevelyan and Sanchez. Trevelyan is probably the best Bond-equal villain the franchise has seen and I love the repartee between and relationship with Bond both as 006 and Janus. However, I can't vote against Franz Sanchez who as many have mentioned, feels like he was born from Fleming. The simplicity of his plan and the brutality of his execution is still one of the best in the series, IMO. The relationship between him and Bond is right up there with Bond and Goldfinger or Largo, IMO.
  • IGotABrudderIGotABrudder UK
    Posts: 631
    Sanchez by far. And the most Flemingesque of the lot. I imagine the Spang brothers in the Diamonds are Forever novel to be a bit like Sanchez.

    Which reminds me, are the Spangs the only major Fleming villains that the films have not yet used?
  • Mathis1Mathis1
    edited June 2020 Posts: 6,949
    Sanchez, by a landslide!
    Brilliant villain, well written and a tremendous nemesis for Bond!
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,050
    JamesStock wrote: »
    Boy these weren't written without bias. ;)

    Carver's plot is super relevant right now and the character written is entertaining. Also in this post-SP era, I like that the villain doesn't come with extra drama/baggage.

    This feathered member tries his hardest to just state the nominees. Occasionally some bias may slip through. ;)
  • GeneralGogolGeneralGogol
    Posts: 928
    I'll give the vote to Elektra King. I think Fleming would've appreciated her character and ambitions.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,042
    I vote for Elektra King. The movie botched it, but this character had great potential for being truly distinctive in the series.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    IGotABrudder wrote: »
    Sanchez by far. And the most Flemingesque of the lot. I imagine the Spang brothers in the Diamonds are Forever novel to be a bit like Sanchez.

    Which reminds me, are the Spangs the only major Fleming villains that the films have not yet used?

    Aside from Mr Sanguinetti, yes.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,527
    Trevelyan
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    Posts: 3,564
    Sanchez reminds me a lot of Scaramanga as he was written. And Trevelyan is the best "evil shadow of Bond" the series has given us so far. Silva is a brilliant villain as well. But I've just got to give my vote to Elliot Carver for his relevance to our own modern world. "Consider him slimed."
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    edited June 2020 Posts: 3,985
    While I'm not a huge fan of LTK, Sanchez is a formidable villain. Brilliant performance from Robert Davi. Sanchez gets my vote 👍
  • jobojobo
    edited June 2020 Posts: 7,506
    May I remind people:

    «This is not a vote for the actor or actress and their performance. It's for the character as it's written. You may consider their plot, how they antagonize Bond, how evil are they.»
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,527
    Sanchez is a great, great villain, don't get me wrong, but he strikes me as a not-extremely-Bondian villain in a not-extremely-Bondian (although, again, very good) film.
    Although I can see how people can say that he could have come straight from Fleming's pages, even if he was written in the novels, he would have been an outlier (like Scaramanga) I think.
  • Max_The_ParrotMax_The_Parrot ATAC to St Cyril’s
    Posts: 2,426
    The DRP provide Silva a sliver of hope
  • BT3366BT3366
    Posts: 1,890
    Tough call between Sanchez and Silva. I'm surprised Stromberg made the list as he's a rewritten Blofeld, by far my least favorite main villain.

    So it's the man who maimed Bond's best friend and killed his wife or the man who killed M? Given Sanchez was originally supposed to be a Chinese warlord and his being more complex than a drug dealer or Miami Vice villain as some think of him, I will go with Silva as my choice.

    His influence and presence are felt long before he's onscreen. His introduction is maybe my favorite of any main Bond villain, he takes part in the action, is not in the film too much and actually accomplishes his goal of killing M.
  • RevelatorRevelator
    Posts: 2,899
    Going through the nominees...

    * Karl Stromberg: Larger than life but never comes to it. Great concept but many aspects of the character (webbed hands, etc.) aren't stressed as well as they should be. Needed more fanaticism.

    * Elliot Carver: Enjoyably broad caricature of an amoral press baron, but the character is all surface.

    * Electra King: The outlines and attributes for a great character are there, but they never coalesce into one. Perhaps even more perversity was needed?

    * Alec Trevelyan: Starts out as a dark mirror of Bond, but his motivation for betraying Britain has always felt contrived to me. And then he turns into a standard evil-mastermind-in-a-big-lair Bond villain. A rogue Bond wouldn't go that route (because Bond isn't personally ambitious).

    * Silva: Best villain of the Craig era (so far). Convincing motivation and even a Flemingian physical deformity and classic monologue. Plus many touches of perversity. But his ability to stay a thousand steps ahead of everybody shows what Skyfall borrowed from the Dark Knight's Joker.

    * Franz Sanchez: Gets my vote. If Fleming lived long enough to create a drug lord...
    Sanchez is also the only one of these villains who seems like a rounded character and convincingly human one. He even has a tragic flaw, his value for loyalty. Bond wins by exploiting Sanchez's twisted sense of honor. One of the few Bond villains who perishes because of his personal contradictions.
  • FatherValentineFatherValentine England
    Posts: 737
    Sanchez. I agree with the general assessment of the others, but Sanchez is the most rounded. And I agree with @Revelator that SIlva's scheme and his ability to have thought that Bond might chase him into a specific underground room years in advance etc, stops him from being the best.

    I would also quite like to live Sanchez's life, unlike the rest.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,055
    This is possibly the toughest round yet. Trevelyan would be my personal favourite, but I think as written, Sanchez is the most lively and has some of the best dialogue. He's also probably the meanest. So, I'd have to go with Sanchez.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,760
    If we included the ranking of the movie in general and the performance of the actor, my vote would definitely go to Silva from SF.

    But considering the criteria stated I'm with those who consider the top "original" villain:
    Franz Sanchez.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,050
    I included Stromberg just for kicks. I normally cap it at 5 nominees. Surprised no one has mentioned Greene not making the list.

    I like the way Electra turns and plays vulnerable and then becomes ruthless. I like that by the end of the film you really dislike her. For some reason I am cheering for Sanchez and feel sad for his downfall. I don't even have hate for him when Leiter gets maimed. Not sure if that's the character or the script that leaves me feeling with this towards him.

  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    edited June 2020 Posts: 23,707
    Franz Sanchez wants to create cocaine from oil in LTK wins.

    006 could have won this for me, tough choice.

  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited June 2020 Posts: 15,269
    Yeah I find this one very hard to judge. I love the whole idea of Carver but he's not a brilliantly written character.

    It's between Silva and Sanchez for me too. Silva is a fantastic baddie and he has wonderful lines and I actually rather like his relationship with Bond: he's M's old favourite and Bond is her new one so he thinks they kind of share a bond. I can't shake the idea that it's the performance making it great in some part though.

    So I'll have to go with Sanchez too, if we're talking on the script. He's actually a baddie given depth, we even start to feel a glimmer of sympathy a little for him the more we get to know him: he's that rare Bond villain who actually treats people well (those that are loyal to him anyway). I do think LTK has a much better script and story than it is an actual good movie, and he's part of that.
  • MooseWithFleasMooseWithFleas Philadelphia
    edited June 2020 Posts: 3,352
    I'll go with Sanchez. Loved his dynamic with Bond and how it was interwoven with Hong Kong narcotics and the DIAs efforts to bring him down. I only wish they kept the deleted scene where he is giving an interview on tv
  • jobojobo
    edited June 2020 Posts: 7,506
    thedove wrote: »
    I included Stromberg just for kicks. I normally cap it at 5 nominees. Surprised no one has mentioned Greene not making the list.

    I like the way Electra turns and plays vulnerable and then becomes ruthless. I like that by the end of the film you really dislike her. For some reason I am cheering for Sanchez and feel sad for his downfall. I don't even have hate for him when Leiter gets maimed. Not sure if that's the character or the script that leaves me feeling with this towards him.


    Now that you mention it... Greene is a pretty interestingly conceived villain ;)

    However the one villain I really think should have made the list is Zorin. His back story, twistedness, fame and fortune, side scheme with the cheating with horses, his pure cynicism and evil... it all screams Fleming to me.
  • IGotABrudderIGotABrudder UK
    Posts: 631
    Forgot about Zorin. ‘Intuitive improvisation’ :))

    The only villainous character from the Craig years that I really like is Mr White.
  • BennyBenny In the shadowsAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 14,912
    Sanchez for the win.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,050
    I interrupt the voting to ask a favour of the academy. Is anyone tech savy enough to assist me in posting pictures in this thread? I have an idea for our next category but it will require pictures in the post and I am not a techie! :) Please PM me if you are up for the challenge of assisting me in the next category.

    Please continue the voting! :)
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,204
    I can assist if you still need it, @thedove. Will PM.
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