Left on the editing room floor.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,905
    I love how some people are angry at certain scene's unrealistic nature. They're Bond films people, that can't be stopped. A large majority are sadly more OTT than realistic.
  • 007RogerMoore007RogerMoore
    Posts: 1,051
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 said:

    I love how some people are angry at certain scene's unrealistic nature. They're Bond films people, that can't be stopped. A large majority are sadly more OTT than realistic.



    Agree, Bond is not a realistic movie series, IMO, so why watch Bond if one hates OTT?
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi
    Posts: 5,988
    There's a difference between OTT and physically impossible or technically unachievable for at least a century. Now then, the invisible car, e.g., I dig more than I do the VR stuff.
  • darren_blacksmithdarren_blacksmith
    Posts: 672
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 said:

    I love how some people are angry at certain scene's unrealistic nature. They're Bond films people, that can't be stopped. A large majority are sadly more OTT than realistic.



    There's a line though between the fantastic and fantasy. The volcano lair in YOLT is fantastical but it's not fantasy as its all perfectly possible, if you had enough money.

    Bond occupies a very careful balance between realism and the fantastic. As Sam Mendes observed, it's not a superhero movie but it's not totally realistic either. It can get away with science fictional elements if they are done carefully and are possible within the era we live in.

    And even then, if you want to do something fantastical, you better make an attempt to make it look real. Either by setting up the possibility of it earlier in the film ( eg in Goldeneye they show Bond leaping off the dam (for real!) which later *just* about buys them the cheeky licence to show him leaping off the motorbike mid-air to get to the falling plane) or make it look roughed up messy and realistic ( ie the 'lived-in' look of the star wars universe ).

    It's like the difference between the two genres of science fiction and fantasy. It's like the old phrase that fiction must make sense (but reality doesn't have to!).

    Finally what makes it worse is that it's random and irrelevant to the plot! You can forgive things that are OTT if they are really important to pushing the plot along, or if they make an important thematic point, but that VR scene... Wtf?!

    If you just want to insert totally random fake drama and fantasy technology then you might as well let Michael Bay or a 12 year old hyperactive schoolboy direct Bond.

    Hey let's have a scene where Bond realises he has a magic ring like Green Lantern and can fly, then he has to fight aliens and then it all turns out to be a dream! Like, cool!!!
  • ZekidkZekidk
    Posts: 1,047
    Volante said:

    I would completely re-edit QOS, get rid of the quick cutting in action scenes.


    + 1. If it hadn't been for the seizurecam and blink-and-you-missed-it editing, QoS would have been in my top 10.
  • FireSkullFireSkull
    Posts: 135
    @M_Balje Casino Royale was a perfect Bond Movie. I'd change absolutely nothing in it!
    Quantum Of Solace was a disaster due to as Craig says, "Bad Direction". Seemed like in the movie, everybody knows James Bond. Like, "hey look! It's James Bond!" Excuse me, he's a spy!!
    I wish Die Another Day was different. Die Another Day started so strong that it could have been the best! I'll delete every Chinese/Korean (they all look alike!) thing from the movie. The sword fight scene was boring. Instead I would take it to Iraq or Afghanistan.
  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 4,674
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 said:

    JWESTBROOK said:

    Volante said:

    I would completely re-edit QOS, get rid of the quick cutting in action scenes.



    I have the ability to that. May do it over the summer.


    ^:)^ I don't know how, but if you would that'd be awesome. It seems the editing is everyone's biggest peeve, and I wonder what people would think of the film if the editing wasn't shaky.


    Again, it would shorten the film by a large margin. All I'd be doing is cutting the unnecessary bits out to make it flow smoother. It worked well for the chase, but it went from approx. a 5 minute sequence to a 3 minute sequence...
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    Posts: 2,329
    I would edit out every sight and sound gag out of the Moore era and all CGI from the Brosnan era. Meaning large portions of Moonraker and DAD would have to go. Top on my list from each era-

    1. That STUPID slide whistle in TMWTGG. Lowbrow humor like this takes the class out of Bond movies. Caters to children or those adults with that level of thinking capacity. Needs a great Barry musical buildup instead.

    2. The opening PTS of Goldeneye. Instead of that highly unlikely MR-like catch a plane stunt, Bond uses his wits to get out of the canyon and catch a plane he has stashed nearby. Would make for a longer PTS but a much better and more believable one.
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    Posts: 2,329
    My son would like to add that the Tarzan yell in Octopussy should go A.S.A.P
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,905
    SirHenryLeeChaChing said:

    I would edit out every sight and sound gag out of the Moore era and all CGI from the Brosnan era. Meaning large portions of Moonraker and DAD would have to go. Top on my list from each era-

    1. That STUPID slide whistle in TSWLM. Lowbrow humor like this takes the class out of Bond movies. Caters to children or those adults with that level of thinking capacity. Needs a great Barry musical buildup instead.

    2. The opening PTS of Goldeneye. Instead of that highly unlikely MR-like catch a plane stunt, Bond uses his wits to get out of the canyon and catch a plane he has stashed nearby. Would make for a longer PTS but a much better and more believable one.


    There would be no Moore era! Oh, I do like the sound of that. :>

    SirHenryLeeChaChing said:

    My son would like to add that the Tarzan yell in Octopussy should go A.S.A.P



    Your son is very intelligent!
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    Posts: 2,329
    @ O'Brady- was there ever any doubt that I would do what I could to make sure my boy (he's 11) would be raised right in Bond? :D

    In all fairness though, he really likes Octopussy and it is one of his favorites. Which I am fine with, I want him to form his own opinions. I always tell him he does not have to agree with me. He tends to see the greater good in the movie which I love because I feel the same way, as bad as MR and DAD are for example, I always try to find the good stuff and try to remember that more than the bad. I certainly don't want him to be the kind of person who calls Bond movies "turds" and should be flushed down a toilet (or loo if you prefer). If you can actually call a person like that a real Bond fan, that is. IMO, those types of people are entitled to their opinion as everyone is, to me they are just not credible ones and I will be very happy to never engage in dialogue with them. There are good things about EVERY Bond movie. I sure would not want my son to turn out that way.

  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,052
    I'd definitely focus all my attention of Goldfinger's lackluster, disappointing mess of an ending. First, I'd show Auric, a handful of thugs (maybe two or three), and Miss Galore hijacking the President's plane. Then, I'd continue on as normal until when Auric shows himself to 007. Then, I'd make his monolouge longer, and then begin the fight shortly after that. Now, this fight would be exceptionally brutal like the previous fights with the Capungo or Red Grant in FRWL, and would feautre Bond duking it out with Auric and his two or three thugs. As for the plane pressurization, that would come when it was just Bond vs. Goldfinger, but the latter would not be sucked out, but instead be strangled to death by Bond, much like the novel's ending. Then, continue as normal, but show Bond and Miss Galore leaping out of the plane sharing a parachute, much like QoS with Camille. Then, continue as normal until the credits.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 4,578
    I'd cut out the sequence where Moore and Bouquet 'go for a drive in the country' in For Your Eyes Only in Spain. It goes on far too long, but not quite as long as the monastery climb near the end, (nothing on earth could), but I always found it dull and interesting, it's not so bad when Moore first arrives at the Gonzales hideaway, and he gets caught snooping about, but when Havelock says 'we can use my car', it just descends into a boring sequence of uninteresting bits. May have said it before too, but the end climb in Greece could of been trimmed by at least five minutes. A minimum on Julian Glover would of been appreciated too, as he's one of the most mundane and banal adversaries of the entire series, offers no threat whatsoever, I would liked to have seen a bit more of the parrot also if I'm being honest
  • M_BaljeM_Balje
    Posts: 900


    At 00.31 seconds i jump to 0.42. 00.31-00.42 complete removed.
    Then after the in my opnion but dificult to cut talk between 1.17-1.30 i cut from 1.30 til the moment of Miranda 1.30-1.44. (So Miranda Frost wil start then on 01.30). After 1.46 i wil jump to 2.09 when she show his room. The 3 seconds after this stay. The music wil be difrent or atleast not that way of camera move. Keep the joke about the martini and the ice. After she said James i wil make a cut again and again wil start with Frost (3.03). No piguin or for the view again line and what Bond said. Then 3.29-7.33 nothing. From 7.33-7.37 removed, better known as the Matrix cut. From 7.56-8.18 removed, in those there is one moment with first glimp of the laser i keep that but at after Zoa then only line to Jinx and then go to 007 (8.20). Bond said ''Jinx'' (9.33) what 1-2 seconds should be removed too.

    If you ask me the whole laser thing should be removed, there is way to do this and that is after Graves busted Jinx (7.10), Graves take her to the ice palace (what happend later in the movie.) This means that Bond under the ice should not end at Jinx but should end somewhere ele's. Funny or not official after Bond saved Jinx. Bond tell Graves Bond knowns Graves is Moon.
    With removing a litle bit of Bond enter the Laser place (It look like he stil looking) and also remove Jinx enter the door it wil look like Jinx already been there. The talking contune before Bond saved him self with ring. The only thing Jinx did after Bond saved her is go back to the ice palace, so why bother about the laser fight if you can do or there bring Jinx there wil one litle cut.

    On this way the movie be no longer 132 minutes (127 minutes pall time) but 127/122 if you already removed this.

  • OHMSS69OHMSS69
    Posts: 1,092
    I would re shoot Elektra's death in TWINE. I wouldl have M kill her and not Bond.
    Maybe have her get the drop on Bond when he hesitates for a split second and "blam" M shoots her dead.
    I would have killed Renaud prior to this. Elektra was the main villian and should have been killed last.
  • fire_and_icefire_and_ice
    Posts: 954
    @M_Balje I agree i think the laser sequence in DAD is one of the worst sequences in any bond movie, also the dialog is terrible.
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,052
    fire_and_ice said:

    @M_Balje I agree i think the laser sequence in DAD is one of the worst sequences in any bond movie, also the dialog is terrible.



    The dialogue is indeed terrible ("Haha, I'll use the laser!"; "Don't make a mess"), but the fight itself is really fun and well done in my opinion. I wish it had been longer in fact, I could have seen Bond taking more time to beat up a heavy like Mr. Kil, but the movie was running around 2 hours and 15 minutes, so I can see the need for edits.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 4,578
    Anyone mentioned the Brosnan car chase in the underground garage in Tomorrow Never Dies, just does little for me, gets a bit silly, - 'getz ze sledg'ammers-', and Brosnans' crouching out of sight with his remote control and dives through the window and some silly mayhem ensues, it's just all a bit dull, and if I had my way i'd omit the whole sequence, it comes to an equally, if not more so, daft conclusion with the Avis car going over the roof and crashing through the window below, I'd be snipping away at that like a rabid Edward Scissorhands..
  • fire_and_icefire_and_ice
    Posts: 954
    Baltimore_007 said:

    Anyone mentioned the Brosnan car chase in the underground garage in Tomorrow Never Dies, just does little for me, gets a bit silly, - 'getz ze sledg'ammers-', and Brosnans' crouching out of sight with his remote control and dives through the window and some silly mayhem ensues, it's just all a bit dull, and if I had my way i'd omit the whole sequence, it comes to an equally, if not more so, daft conclusion with the Avis car going over the roof and crashing through the window below, I'd be snipping away at that like a rabid Edward Scissorhands..



    It is a bit daft i can only assume carvers henchmen regularly sledgehammer people cars that they don't like :) I wonder if every car they come across is bullet proof and electricutes them, then its time to bring in the sledge hammers Lol
  • fire_and_icefire_and_ice
    Posts: 954
    00Beast said:

    fire_and_ice said:

    @M_Balje I agree i think the laser sequence in DAD is one of the worst sequences in any bond movie, also the dialog is terrible.



    The dialogue is indeed terrible ("Haha, I'll use the laser!"; "Don't make a mess"), but the fight itself is really fun and well done in my opinion. I wish it had been longer in fact, I could have seen Bond taking more time to beat up a heavy like Mr. Kil, but the movie was running around 2 hours and 15 minutes, so I can see the need for edits.


    Too much cgi lasers for me, Though admittedly mr kills death is not pretty, laser through back of the head ouch! shame it did not accidentally hit jinx :)
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,052
    fire_and_ice said:

    00Beast said:

    fire_and_ice said:

    @M_Balje I agree i think the laser sequence in DAD is one of the worst sequences in any bond movie, also the dialog is terrible.



    The dialogue is indeed terrible ("Haha, I'll use the laser!"; "Don't make a mess"), but the fight itself is really fun and well done in my opinion. I wish it had been longer in fact, I could have seen Bond taking more time to beat up a heavy like Mr. Kil, but the movie was running around 2 hours and 15 minutes, so I can see the need for edits.


    Too much cgi lasers for me, Though admittedly mr kills death is not pretty, laser through back of the head ouch! shame it did not accidentally hit jinx :)


    HAHAHAHA! Now there would be a desirable alternate ending!
  • nobodydoesitbetternobodydoesitbetter
    Posts: 466
    i'm going to go with what is probably the worst sequence ever in a James Bond film. I would remove the "surfing cgi wave" in DAD. I still don't understand how the producers could have let that scene on the screen. In the directors commentary for DAD Lee Tamahori admits that was his idea and it wasn't in the original screenplay. They should have stopped him!
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 4,578
    It was just another factor in an overall unmitigated mess, for the most part, for that years release and Brosnan's final say, yes, it is quite cringeworthy whenever you watch it, along with several other scenes most likely. I 'd have edited out the whole Berry character too, goes without saying. Michael Madsen is a fine actor, done some good work, but did we really need his Damien Falco character in there, it was the first and last time we saw him, and I think in retrospect he could easily have been snipped out. Also 'Mr Kil' can go too, what a dumb character that was. I can't quite bring myself to leave out anyone else maybe, Gustav Graves was OK, Miranda Frost was fine with me, and John Cleese' Q, was fun to watch
  • nobodydoesitbetternobodydoesitbetter
    Posts: 466
    Its a bit weird...while the double take pidgeon in MR is just weird and the awful sound effect during the car flip is just embarrassing ,and in my opinion a bit disrespectful to the stunt team in TMWTGG, i can still watch them and except them. The surfing scene in DAD is just wrong. There is a bunch of dreadful stuff in DAD - invisible car, the terrible final sequence on the plane, robo suit to name a few. There could be a good film in there if a lot of stuff was put on the cutting room floor. The problem though would be that the film would be over in about 15 minutes.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 4,578
    If Die another Day had a duration of less than 15 minutes, people would welcome it with open arms, but it wouldn't be much of a watch though..

    Thing is, for however bad a Bond release is, or how long it's on for, with exception to the actual theater release, we can simply fast forward or skip the bits we simply don't want to see at home, I think that's all very well and good

    I would never take out the pigeon from Moonraker, it has reached legendary status so far as the franchise goes, if you take him away, it's like leaving Clark Gable out of Gone With The Wind or something, it's an icon of the film industry, just leave it be

    The Car flip in The Man with the Golden Gun is OK, it's just the damn awful sound effects I always take issue with, I could murder sometimes whenever I hear it

    (having all kind of technical difficulties today so I think I'll leave it for a while and try later maybe, page goes static, can't post, cut and paste on to a fresh page, damn annoying actually) :-L
  • nobodydoesitbetternobodydoesitbetter
    Posts: 466
    I agree. The double take pidgeon is a legendary image from the James Bond films of the Moore years. There is a lot of stuff in those Moore films that should be on the cutting room floor...but if they were cut then the films would loose some of their charm...the Moore Bond films are classics...despite some poor decisions. But they were also a product of their time. There are no excuses for CGI wave surfing!...I was watching Moonraker the other day and during the entire running time I kept on thinking - there is nothing in this film as bad as that surfing sequence in DAD. Even the final shootout in space stands up a lot more technically 33years later than that CGI wave!
  • nobodydoesitbetternobodydoesitbetter
    Posts: 466
    i spelt pigeon wrong...sorry...too many vodka martinis....
  • fire_and_icefire_and_ice
    Posts: 954
    most of Roger Moore's wardrobe from AVTAK, some of the clothes roger wore in that movie just seemed to age him even more.
  • CrabKeyCrabKey
    Posts: 106
    Jwestbrook: Great job on the QOS re-edit. For the first time that sequence looks coherent.
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