Goodbye to Judi Dench? (Contains Skyfall Spoilers)

FromCanadaWithLove

I'm happy to hear that Judi Dench is confirmed for Bond 23, but do you think it should be her last outing? I do.

There's nothing wrong with her, but she doesn't have the presence that she used to.

Take Desmond Llewelyn as Q for example. His performance was memorable, but tired, in The World Is Not Enough. Imagine if that scene happened in Goldeneye instead. A new Bond, a new era, and the traditional disappearing. Personally, I feel that Llewelyn's departure was late, and Cleese should never have entered the franchise.

So what about M and Judi Dench? Should she leave? Should she stay? Who would be a good replacement?

00Beast

No, I don't really think she should leave. Even though I like Bernard Lee better, she is still THE M for this day in age. If the style of the movies changed and she herself lost character, then sure, go for someone new. But Lee had 11 films, and she's only running on her 7th, so it's not time yet.

j7wild

Helen Mirren as M

she's about 20-21 years younger than Dench so she can last for about 6-7 Bond films

plus she was good with all kind of firearms in RED, so hopefully they will give M a bit more to do action wise than just sitting in her office counting beans

PanchitoPistoles

j7wild said:
Helen Mirren as M

she's about 20-21 years younger than Dench

Helen Mirren is 11 years younger than Dench. (It took me 10 seconds to look up the age difference between them.)

j7wild

PanchitoPistoles said:

j7wild said:
Helen Mirren as M

she's about 20-21 years younger than Dench

Helen Mirren is 11 years younger than Dench. (It took me 10 seconds to look up the age difference between them.)

so what are you implying?

that you are Archimedes?

PanchitoPistoles

1. That I have no idea where you got that "20-21 years" from.
2. You should have looked up the age difference between them yourself. It does not take that much time.
3. Helen Mirren will be at least 69 years old by the time Bond 24 comes out, so she will be waaay to old to be the new M.

jaguar007

Dench is getting old so I don't think she will be M for too much longer. While I don't think it will happen, I would like to see M become the crusty old male Admiral. If they do stay with a female M, I agree that Helen Mirren would be good in the role (in fact I thought of her before opening this thread).

actonsteve

I think it is time for Dame Judi to be retired. While one of my favourite actresses and you can throw good lines at her "we have people everywhere - I thought it was hyperbole, florists say that" she is turning very judgemental and the character is now very nineties.

To update it - you need a young male M. An operator. A player. Who got where he is via political maneurvering and schmoozing. A man more obcessed with PR then catching spies. A not entirely trustworthy boss would put a new slant on it. In the era of David Cameron and the possibly Tony Blair. In the world of slippery 21st Century politics you need a cunning animal to survive.

..and of course Craig Bond would have nothing but contempt for him.

j7wild

PanchitoPistoles said:
1. That I have no idea where you got that "20-21 years" from.
2. You should have looked up the age difference between them yourself. It does not take that much time.
3. Helen Mirren will be at least 69 years old by the time Bond 24 comes out, so she will be waaay to old to be the new M.

I looked both of them up on IMDB and I miscalculated their age difference.

I am not a Mathematician (Cough Cough, yeah right, you wish!!) like you.

No need to get snotty okay?

Callate la Boca!!

Gracias!

p.s. there is always a rude, condescending person in every other thread here at MI6!!

Alan007

I think this should be her last, an ideal time to have M assassinated and new man brought in. No idea who though :D

PanchitoPistoles

Sorry, j7wild! I apologize. Back to the topic: I think Helen Mirren would be too old as a new M, she would push 70 in Bond 24 and the producers would have to find a new M after 2-3 movies. I would prefer someone who is about 40-50 years old.

DarthDimi

The idea of M going into battle is preposterous!

Risico007

At the rate M's appearences in bond are going is it really the preposterous?

as Long as M doesn't save bond's life by killing the main bad guy.

TheLazenby

I think she should go... I mean, she was paired with a new Bond, and now (possibly) a new Q (unless Cleese returns - which I hope) and a new Moneypenny. There's no reason for her to stick around.

I mean, I found it awkward that Pierce Brosnan's M also saw the 00 promotion of Daniel Craig's Bond.

j7wild

TheLazenby said:

I mean, I found it awkward that Pierce Brosnan's M also saw the 00 promotion of Daniel Craig's Bond.

that didn't make sense to me.... if it's a reboot, what is Judy Dench's M doing there?

are we supposed to forget the Brosnan's Bond films never happened?

DarthDimi

No, I simply think we're not to care about continuity too much. They clearly kept Dench because she's beloved by many as M and a familiar face is never a bad thing.

Samuel001

I really think this would be better discussed after Bond 23. The whole "she doesn't have the presence that she used to" argument could amount to nothing after the first good use of the character in a long time. New direction, new changes.

shadowonthesun

j7wild said:
that didn't make sense to me.... if it's a reboot, what is Judy Dench's M doing there?

Because with a new actor cast as Bond and the removal of Moneypenny and Q, the film needed some familiar elements to make it cognisable as Bond film.

Creasy47

Personally, I'm excited to see her play M again. Never had a problem with her character, so bring on Bond 23.

shadowonthesun

And since QUANTUM OF SOLACE made it pretty clear that Bond has earned M's trust - so much so that she relies on him - so EON can do whatever they want with the Bond-M relationship. The added bonus in all of this is that if Dench leaves the franchise at the end of this film and Bond proves to be the reliable, trustworthy figure that QUANTUM OF SOLACE set him up to be, then her successor can make a reference in BOND 24 to the way Dench made a note in Bond's file that while his methods are unorthodox, he is highly dependable, thus removing any need for a subplot involving Bond having to earn the new M's trust.

JWESTBROOK

I would like to see the quirkiness she had in the Brosnan days. She was more involved I 'spose.

No nasty ideas of bringing a past Bond to be M, either (shivers and gags).
I like(d) Dench. We'll see where Bond 23 takes us, I have a feeling we'll be seeing MP come back as Craig and Dench leave for 23, and then 24 have Fassbender (PLEASE GOD) and someone else, maybe back to a male.

NicNac

I'm not big on the idea of another famous actor playing M, but I imagine that is the way they will go next time round.
When Bond began Lee was a familiar supporting actor, but not a major star. Therefore M was a background support character. His role expanded over the years but it was never over-cooked. Similarly, Robert Brown's M was there but not in the thick of the action.
I like Judi Dench as M but she's a big star so her part needs to be quite significant. M should be there to give Bond his orders and little else.

Char35t

the next should be MALE

plus Dench signed on for 7 films...this is the last one on that contract so is most likely her last...rumored that she wants to go out with a bang.

Samuel001

Char35t said:
Dench signed on for 7 films...this is the last one on that contract

There is no proof of this. Both her and EON want her to stay. She'll be in Bond 24 and beyond.

j7wild

Dalton as M! Dalton as M!

I can see him say to Craig's Bond:

"Smiert Spionem means Death to Spies, Bond! Come back alive!! I was doing this when you were still going through boot camp in the Royal Navy!!"

MajorDSmythe

Goodbye to Judi Dench? Yes, it's about time. I think that she should have left with Brosnan.

DaltonCraig007

Samuel001 said:

Char35t said:
Dench signed on for 7 films...this is the last one on that contract

There is no proof of this. Both her and EON want her to stay. She'll be in Bond 24 and beyond.

She will be 80 in B24... I stand by my belief she was signed for 7 movies, and she will be too old to make more films after B23. I don't want her to pollute more Bond films. If the Craig era aims to be realistic, it starts with Dench bowing out after the next outing. A 80+ years old head of MI6 is laughable. Frankly I am tired of Dench, I don't look forward to more Dench antics after the next one. She's ruined enough scenes for my liking.

Baltimore_007

Thing is though in the films nobody watches M, and thinks 'oh look it's Judy Dench, she's this old, and shouldn't be on screen'. In the films, she may be big cheese in M16 but she's never depicted as how old she is real life, I guess in the films she's just seen as Bond's boss and ages don't really come into it

I've never really had a problem with it, back in 1995 when we were introduced to the first female M figure I never really berated the decision, although the character is seen of in nearly all the Bond movies, it never really plays that much of a pivotal part once the action gets underway

I think she's good for at least another two outings, although never will be able to fill Bernard Lee's shoes

Robert Brown was merely a waste of a character for his four or so Bond films

Samuel001

MajorDSmythe said:
she should have left with Brosnan.

I agree.

DaltonCraig007 said:
I stand by my belief she was signed for 7 movies

Why? Because you want it to be? The two don't correlate. There is no proof of this "contract" either. It's just some way blown out of proportion rumour.

DaltonCraig007 said:
If the Craig era aims to be realistic, it starts with Dench bowing out after the next outing. A 80+ years old head of MI6 is laughable.

It'a already too late for that, as @MajorDSmythe said she should have gone with Brosnan. Realism in that area has never been high on the agenda for Bond.

DaltonCraig007 said:
Frankly I am tired of Dench, I don't look forward to more Dench antics after the next one. She's ruined enough scenes for my liking.

This has more to do with how the character is written. If in Bond 23 it's something like Tomorrow Never Dies - by far Dench's best use to date - then I have no problem with her and neither should you I'd hope. Plus it should be like that as M has now gained Bond's trust. The "antics" should be over.

It's just very unfortunate Bond Begins came after two films which dealt with trust issues themselves, meaning we got four in a row.

shadowonthesun

Char35t said:
the next should be MALE

I agree that we should have a male M next, but I seriously hope you are not suggesting that M should only ever be male.

JWESTBROOK

I was gonna say Michael Sheen, but nahhhhh.

Way better as a villain.

They need a somebody, but not important somebody for M.
Like a "Oh look, its that guy from that one movie I saw that once."

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