FRWL Observation Relating to Broz

edited December 2014 in Bond Movies Posts: 2,483
Pierce is often maligned for his little tie-straightening tic. Fair enough. If you dislike it, you dislike it. However, whilst watching FRWL last night, I noticed that, after Bond polishes off Red Grant, he--yes he does!--straightens his tie. Just thought I'd mention it.
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  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Yeah but that is because he has near been throttled and it needs straightening rather than just doing it because he thinks it's somehow automatically Bondian.

    Rog also does it after he kills Sandor for similar reasons.

    That said I do love it when Broz does it in the tank chase but the one in the boat underwater is like something out of a computer game and is embarrassingly lame.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    I agree. The tie straightening isn't an issue and Brosnan doing it in the tank is fine but that under water scene encapsulated all manner of cheesy and embarrassing fluff the series had descended into.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,686
    Also David Arnold put in an 'epic-esque' moment in his score for the boat chase right when Brosnan straightens his tie.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    doubleoego wrote: »
    I agree. The tie straightening isn't an issue and Brosnan doing it in the tank is fine but that under water scene encapsulated all manner of cheesy and embarrassing fluff the series had descended into.
    Also David Arnold put in an 'epic-esque' moment in his score for the boat chase right when Brosnan straightens his tie.

    Absobloodyexactly.
  • Posts: 11,189
    I've never been too bothered with either tie straightening tbh. Though of the two I prefer the tank one.

    It's just a gimmick. Rog raises his eyebrow, Broz straightens his tie.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,459
    I like the tie straightening in all those scenes. I enjoy the underwater one, too.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited December 2014 Posts: 17,687
    Personally (and this is coming from a DIE HARD Brozzer fan) I didn't much care for the underwater tie-straightening, but I similarly didn't care for Craig's cuff check in SF. Both were winks at me (& us) I didn't particularly need. Not that they were terrible, just unnecessary IMO. At least they weren't Tarzan yells, ja? :))
  • Posts: 14,800
    Pierce is often maligned for his little tie-straightening tic. Fair enough. If you dislike it, you dislike it. However, whilst watching FRWL last night, I noticed that, after Bond polishes off Red Grant, he--yes he does!--straightens his tie. Just thought I'd mention it.

    This is where Brosnan got it from, I think.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2014 Posts: 23,883
    As others have said, if it fits into the scene then it makes sense.

    If it looks like it has just been added to check a box, then it could appear 'forced'.

    The TWINE one appeared forced to me but to some extent so did the SF cuff check. I agree that Arnold's score perhaps emphasized the TWINE moment too much, thereby adding to the comic element.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,687
    bondjames wrote: »
    Arnold's score perhaps emphasized the TWINE moment too much, thereby adding to the comic element.
    It was Arnold saying "Yeah, okay, a Bond box tick here..."
    :))
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    edited April 2015 Posts: 17,728
    I suppose Brosnan wanted to show it was a reflexive action like well polished shoes. It's all a naval/military training thing I suspect. A bit like Moore pulling out his shirt cuffs. I see little real harm in it; I think if anything it adds to the character of Bond although I suppose the underwater fixing of the tie was a tad out of place given the context.
  • Posts: 11,425
    I didn't like the cuff check in SF. But it was in the trailer so may be it just became too familiar. I don't think Craig's Bond needs stuff like that - just keep it stripped back and simple.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    I quite like that as Craig oozes cool and swagger. Without being cheese.
  • edited April 2015 Posts: 11,425
    Nah. Cuff links in Istanbul? Who actually wears cuff links any way? All seems a bit city-boy. Felt the same way about Broz's tie straightening.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited April 2015 Posts: 5,131
    I do. This is some Bondian cheese I don't mind. It's the DAD style 'in jokes' I hate....e.g. Rosa Klebbs shoe in Q's lab.
  • Posts: 11,189
    It was always done because it was seen as looking cool, even when Connery did it in '63 after his fight with Grant.

    It's obviously something people either like or loathe. As it's barely 10 seconds of screentime I don't think it's worth fussing over. The action always amused me anyway.
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,727
    What?! With Brosnan's plethora of annoying habits (forced smirks, mid-atlantic 'smooth car salesman' accent and weird ("uaaauargh!!") grunts when fighting or falling) I can't believe there are some that are irritated merely by the tie thing...
  • Posts: 14,800
    I liked it in GE but not at all in TWINE.
  • Posts: 1,478
    Some actors have a bag of techniques they use over and over that call attention to themselves as performers. SC was the least self-conscious of all the actors to play Bond. Mannerisms such as straightening the tie seem more for himself as audience rather than the film audience. It's the sort of thing one might do if by themselves reacting to a scare.

    For me RM conveyed the awareness of playing Bond, rather than being Bond. PB to a lesser degree, but nonetheless always seeming to project the idea he was playing the role. That viewer perception of playing to the camera weakens a performance.

    One of Craig's recurring techniques is the head shake and gobble during a chase when he crashes to the ground. Particularly noticeable during the opening chase in CR. I can't help but be reminded of Curly from The Three Stooges.

    Despite my often critical comments about RM's acting as Bond, and to a lesser extent, PB, I do recognize the skill and art it takes to be a film actor. Were is easy, wouldn't many of us being do it? But as we know in art, we may appreciate the artistry, but not the product.



  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,727
    CrabKey wrote: »
    Some actors have a bag of techniques they use over and over that call attention to themselves as performers. SC was the least self-conscious of all the actors to play Bond.

    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.
    Which is why they don’t come across as forced or conscious, like Moore’s or Brosnan’s did.

    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,686
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    Sean Connery, or the art of playing a russian or an irishman with the same accent and getting an Oscar for it.

  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,727
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    Sean Connery, or the art of playing a russian or an irishman with the same accent and getting an Oscar for it.

    Don't think any of the other 007 actors are any good at accents either though :D
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,686
    AceHole wrote: »
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    Sean Connery, or the art of playing a russian or an irishman with the same accent and getting an Oscar for it.

    Don't think any of the other 007 actors are any good at accents either though :D

    I did like when Sir Rog speaks spanish in FYEO and german in OP! :D
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,727
    AceHole wrote: »
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    Sean Connery, or the art of playing a russian or an irishman with the same accent and getting an Oscar for it.

    Don't think any of the other 007 actors are any good at accents either though :D

    I did like when Sir Rog speaks spanish in FYEO and german in OP! :D

    Ha, yes!
    Better than PB's 'German' in TND at the Avis counter... sounded like he was coughing up a nasty fur-ball... :|
  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    edited April 2015 Posts: 7,567
    AceHole wrote: »

    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.
    Which is why they don’t come across as forced or conscious, like Moore’s or Brosnan’s did.

    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    This!

    The trouble was it left a legacy hanging over the part that had other actors scrabbling for the A-Z of acting technique; trying to replicate what Connery did, instead of just doing their own thing.
    Brosnan's oft-repeated story of practicing 'Bond..James Bond' in front of the bathroom mirror is a case in point. Connery created the ultimate delivery of the line and all actors have struggled with it ever since. And when Brosnan did do it we got a mid-Atlantic 'Baaand..James Baaand' accompanied by a self-conscious smirk that would have embarrassed even Roger Moore.

    Craig seems to be one actor who has laid the ghost of Connery/Bond to rest and actually got to grips with his own interpretation of the role.

    Love @CrabKey's comparison of Craig and Curly from The 3 Stooges though...even though I'm a Craig fan. Made me laugh.
  • Posts: 11,189
    NicNac wrote: »
    AceHole wrote: »

    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.
    Which is why they don’t come across as forced or conscious, like Moore’s or Brosnan’s did.

    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    This!

    The trouble was it left a legacy hanging over the part that had other actors scrabbling for the A-Z of acting technique; trying to replicate what Connery did, instead of just doing their own thing.
    Brosnan's oft-repeated story of practicing 'Bond..James Bond' in front of the bathroom mirror is a case in point. Connery created the ultimate delivery of the line and all actors have struggled with it ever since. And when Brosnan did do it we got a mid-Atlantic 'Baaand..James Baaand' accompanied by a self-conscious smirk that would have embarrassed even Roger Moore.

    Craig seems to be one actor who has laid the ghost of Connery/Bond to rest and actually got to grips with his own interpretation of the role.

    Love @CrabKey's comparison of Craig and Curly from The 3 Stooges though...even though I'm a Craig fan. Made me laugh.

    I partly agree with this.

    Both Moore and Dalton have said that they had to try and be different to their predecessor, but I'm quite certain that Connery's legacy nonetheless hung over them.

    For Dalton, it must have felt quite intimidating coming after TWO very popular Bond's.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    suavejmf wrote: »
    I quite like that as Craig oozes cool and swagger. Without being cheese.

    Precisely.

  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    AceHole wrote: »
    CrabKey wrote: »
    Some actors have a bag of techniques they use over and over that call attention to themselves as performers. SC was the least self-conscious of all the actors to play Bond.

    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.
    Which is why they don’t come across as forced or conscious, like Moore’s or Brosnan’s did.

    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    Spot on.
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    edited April 2015 Posts: 1,727
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.


    To expand slightly: everything about Connery’s physical acting flowed from the concept of a strong, commanding alpha - the one in control and supremely confident.

    The cheeky, irreverent grins ; his calm but always deliberate & decisive movements, none of which were wasted, were his basis of the character.
    Watch his performances closely (DN & FRWL in particular) and you will see that he NEVER wastes any movement. Every movement is intended, every aspect of his kinetic acting has a pre-destined purpose. He is never hurried. His movement is always deliberate, based on the assumption that he is in control. Always the dominant player…
    Except for a few scenes with M, where his demeanor is more that of a reluctant, rather obnoxious student who respects his mentor but does not accept his lower pecking order.

    Sean was a hypnotic actor not because of his line delivery or ‘method’, à la De Niro (the things most people associate with good actors) – but because he was simply the best physical actor of his generation.
    THAT’s why he could never be surpassed as James Bond. Because 007 is an inherently physical role. He never waxes lyrical. He just… DOES.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2015 Posts: 23,883
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.
    Which is why they don’t come across as forced or conscious, like Moore’s or Brosnan’s did.

    Connery was not a gifted method actor, nor a good mimic (his accent barely changed from part to part) but he was a truly excellent physical actor.

    Indeed.

    In my opinion, since Bond is as 'alpha male' as it gets, Connery, naturally being more that way, translated best on screen. Bond was just a natural fit for him.

    Having said that, I think all the Bond actors have brought their own movement & persona to the screen though - some have been more successful at it than others imho.

    The trick is to be yourself as well and not try to emulate or imitate what is not yours. From my perspective, Moore (naturally suave), Craig (naturally rugged) & Dalton (naturally withdrawn/complex) all did that well because they emphasized dominating aspects of their own persona in their characterization. Many may not like this as much as Connery's original, but regardless, they had to do this in order to make the interpretation credible.
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